Advent Talk

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  

News:

You can find an active Save 3ABN website at http://www.Save-3ABN.com.

Pages: 1 ... 8 9 [10]
 91 
 on: January 15, 2017, 03:25:51 AM 
Started by reddogs - Last post by reddogs
So Ellen White says the living at the end comprise the 144,000 and are singled out and why, and thus its clear the resurrected or dead saints are separate from the 144,000.

“The living saints, 144,000 in number, knew and understood the voice, while the wicked thought it was thunder and an earthquake. When God spoke the time, He poured upon us the Holy Ghost, and our faces began to light up and shine with the glory of God, as Moses' did when he came down from Mount Sinai.” CET 58.

...And they sing "a new song" before the throne, a song which no man can learn save the hundred and forty and four thousand. It is the song of Moses and the Lamb--a song of deliverance. None but the hundred and forty-four thousand can learn that song; for it is the song of their experience--an experience such as no other company have ever had. "These are they which follow the Lamb whithersoever He goeth." These, having been translated from the earth, from among the living, are counted as "the first fruits unto God and to the Lamb." GC 1888 page 649.

Experience and Views, Page 11, she speaks of the living saints at the time the voice of God is heard, as being 144,000 in number and the wicked being enraged and trying to rush violently up to lay hands on them those living at the end to put them in prison, and the saints "would stretch forth the hand in the name of the Lord, and the wicked would fall helpless to the ground." 

Speaking of the 144,000 Ellen White explains: “Why were they [the 144,000] so specially singled out? Because they had to stand with a wonderful truth right before the whole world, and receive their opposition, and while receiving this opposition they were to remember that they were sons and daughters of God, that they must have Christ formed within them the hope of glory. They were ever keeping in view the great and blessed hope that is before them. What is it? It is an eternal weight of glory. Nothing could surpass it. {1SAT 72.3}

 92 
 on: January 15, 2017, 02:57:12 AM 
Started by reddogs - Last post by reddogs
Now lets go back to see the characteristics of the 144,000. We saw in Revelation 7 in verse 3 that they are sealed, “3 Saying, Hurt not the earth, neither the sea, nor the trees, till we have sealed the servants of our God in their foreheads.4 And I heard the number of them which were sealed: and there were sealed an hundred and forty and four thousand of all the tribes of the children of Israel.”

In Revelation 14 verse 1, we find the same sealing:

“1 And I looked, and, lo, a Lamb stood on the mount Sion, and with him an hundred forty and four thousand, having his Father's name written in their foreheads.” Revelation 14

 SOP tells us in Testimonies for the Church, vol. 3, Page 266: “The true people of God, who have the spirit of the work of the Lord and the salvation of souls at heart, will ever view sin in its real, sinful character. They will always be on the side of faithful and plain dealing with sins which easily beset the people of God. Especially in the closing work for the church, in the sealing time of the one hundred and forty-four thousand who are to stand without fault before the throne of God, will they feel most deeply the wrongs of God's professed people.." {3T 266.2}

 So we see “in the closing work for the church, in the sealing time of the one hundred and forty-four thousand who are to stand without fault before the throne of God”.

So what description does scripture give, we find Revelation 14 verse 3 & 4:

“3 And they sung as it were a new song before the throne, and before the four beasts, and the elders: and no man could learn that song but the hundred and forty and four thousand, which were redeemed from the earth.

 4 These are they which were not defiled with women; for they are virgins. These are they which follow the Lamb whithersoever he goeth. These were redeemed from among men, being the firstfruits unto God and to the Lamb..” Revelation 14:3-4

 We see in verse 4 that these are ‘virgins’, or undefiled by the corruption Satan has out there in false doctrines or teachings. God’s end-time people are wholeheartedly dedicated to God following the Lamb wherever He goes.

 We also read in the SOP in Reflecting Christ, p. 226, the terrible battle they will fight:“ In vision I saw two armies in terrible conflict. One army was led by banners bearing the world's insignia; the other was led by the bloodstained banner of Prince Immanuel. Standard after standard was left to trail in the dust as company after company from the Lord's army joined the foe and tribe after tribe from the ranks of the enemy united with the commandment-keeping people of God. An angel flying in the midst of heaven put the standard of Immanuel into many hands, while a mighty general cried out with a loud voice: "Come into line. Let those who are loyal to the commandments of God and the testimony of Christ now take their position. Come out from among them, and be ye separate." The battle raged. Victory alternated from side to side. At last the victory was gained. The army following the banner with the inscription, "The commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus," was gloriously triumphant.... Satan will work his miracles to deceive; he will set up his power as supreme. The church may appear as about to fall, but it does not fall. It remains, while the sinners in Zion will be sifted out--the chaff separated from the precious wheat. This is a terrible ordeal, but nevertheless it must take place. None but those who have been overcoming by the blood of the Lamb and the word of their testimony will be found with the loyal and true, without spot or stain of sin, without guile in their mouths. We must be divested of our self-righteousness and arrayed in the righteousness of Christ.” This is the church triumphant, lets compare this to Revelation 14, verse 5:

“5 And in their mouth was found no guile: for they are without fault before the throne of God.” Revelation 14:5

 SOP in the Great Controversy pages 648-649, tells us that they are those who are living at the end and have overcome:

“Upon the crystal sea before the throne, that sea of glass as it were mingled with fire,--so resplendent is it with the glory of God,--are gathered the company that have "gotten the victory over the beast, and over his image, and over his mark, and over the number of his name." With the Lamb upon Mount Zion, "having the harps of God," they stand, the hundred and forty and four thousand that were redeemed from among men; and there is heard, as the sound of many waters, and as the sound of a great thunder, "the voice of harpers harping with their harps." And they sing "a new song" before the throne, a song which no man can learn save the hundred and forty and four thousand. It is the song of Moses and the Lamb--a song of deliverance. None but the hundred and forty-four thousand can learn that song; for it is the song of their experience--an experience such as no other company have ever had. "These are they which follow the Lamb whithersoever He goeth." These, having been translated from the earth, from among the living, are counted as "the first fruits unto God and to the Lamb." ….. they have stood without an intercessor through the final outpouring of God's judgments.

 But they have been delivered, for they have "washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb." "In their mouth was found no guile: for they are without fault" before God.

 Many Christians may think they can survive this time such as never was, but only a remnant “who have washed their robes and made them white” are prepared for it.?

 Speaking of the 144,000 Ellen White explains: “Why were they [the 144,000] so specially singled out? Because they had to stand with a wonderful truth right before the whole world, and receive their opposition, and while receiving this opposition they were to remember that they were sons and daughters of God, that they must have Christ formed within them the hope of glory. They were ever keeping in view the great and blessed hope that is before them. What is it? It is an eternal weight of glory. Nothing could surpass it. {1SAT 72.3}

 So how do we have our robes washed and be prepared, the SOP has the following in Steps to Christ pp. 64,65 :

“No deep-seated love for Jesus can dwell in the heart that does not realize its own sinfulness . . . if we do not see our own moral deformity, it is unmistakable evidence that we have not had a view of the beauty and excellence of Christ . . . A view of our sinfulness drives us to Him who can pardon; and when the soul, realizing its helplessness, reaches out after Christ, He will reveal Himself in power. The more our sense of need drives us to Him and to the word of God, the more exalted views we shall have of His Character, and the more fully we shall reflect His image.” Steps to Christ pp. 64,65.

 93 
 on: January 15, 2017, 02:55:59 AM 
Started by reddogs - Last post by reddogs
So lets look at the 144,000 starting at Revelation 7 verse 1:

“1 And after these things I saw four angels standing on the four corners of the earth, holding the four winds of the earth, that the wind should not blow on the earth, nor on the sea, nor on any tree.2 And I saw another angel ascending from the east, having the seal of the living God: and he cried with a loud voice to the four angels, to whom it was given to hurt the earth and the sea,3 Saying, Hurt not the earth, neither the sea, nor the trees, till we have sealed the servants of our God in their foreheads.4 And I heard the number of them which were sealed: and there were sealed an hundred and forty and four thousand of all the tribes of the children of Israel.”

Revelation 7:1-4

 Some Christians assert that the text refers to Jews only so we first need to determine whether or not this 144,000 are actually 12,000 literal Israelites from their 12 respective tribes. Lets turn to Galatians 3:29 and read it:

“29 And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.” Galatians 3:29King James Version (KJV)

 Next we read from Paul, the following of who is a true Jew in Romans 2:28-29:

“28 For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh:29 But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.” Romans 2:28-29

 Next we read from James what shows that the Apostles viewed the tribes in a spiritual sense. “James, a servant of God and of the Lord Jesus Christ, to the 12 tribes which are scattered abroad, greetings” (James 1:1). The content of James’ letter is clearly addressed to Christians, and yet he plainly refers to them as spiritual Jews from 12 spiritual tribes. So its clear that it is referring to spiritual Israel regardless of whether they were Jew or Gentile by blood.

 94 
 on: January 15, 2017, 02:48:12 AM 
Started by reddogs - Last post by reddogs
Now lets look at Matthew 5:48 which has perplexed me for a long time as to when, and I am sure others also. Lets read what it has to say:

“Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.” Matthew 5:48.

 Now SOP in Early Writings, Page 71, makes clear, at the end, we will be without an intercessor: “I also saw that many do not realize what they must be in order to live in the sight of the Lord without a high priest in the sanctuary through the time of trouble. Those who receive the seal of the living God and are protected in the time of trouble must reflect the image of Jesus fully.” {EW 71.1} Its confirmed in the Great Controversy page 614, Ellen White states, “When He leaves the sanctuary, darkness covers the inhabitants of the earth. In that fearful time the righteous must live in the sight of a holy God without an intercessor.” (GC 614).

 Hebrews describes the role of Jesus as our mediator in heaven. And yet from SOP, its clear there will be a time when there is no mediator at all, and in that time, “we must reflect the image of Jesus fully” SOP (7BC 977.11 ) says this represents the character of the people of God for these last days.

 Now lets read John 16:25-27:

“25 These things have I spoken unto you in proverbs: but the time cometh, when I shall no more speak unto you in proverbs, but I shall shew you plainly of the Father.26 At that day ye shall ask in my name: and I say not unto you, that I will pray the Father for you:27 For the Father himself loveth you, because ye have loved me, and have believed that I came out from God.”

So a time will come when Jesus will not pray to the Father on our behalf, because we will know that “the Father himself loves us.” Now the statement from Ellen White that we are to “stand in the sight of a holy God without a mediator (GC 425) is clearer. As long as we need a mediator we will have one. But in John 16, Jesus promises us a time will come when we won’t have a mediator because we won’t need one for those that truly know and love Christ.

 In Great Controversy page 614 we read, “When the third angel's message closes, mercy no longer pleads for the guilty inhabitants of the earth. The people of God have accomplished their work. They have received "the latter rain," "the refreshing from the presence of the Lord," and they are prepared for the trying hour before them. Angels are hastening to and fro in heaven. An angel returning from the earth announces that his work is done; the final test has been brought upon the world, and all who have proved themselves loyal to the divine precepts have received "the seal of the living God." Then Jesus ceases His intercession in the sanctuary above. He lifts His hands and with a loud voice says, "It is done;" and all the angelic host lay off their crowns as He makes the solemn announcement:”

Now let’s turn to a familiar verse in our Bibles in Revelation 22:11:

“He that is unjust, let him be unjust still: and he which is filthy, let him be filthy still: and he that is righteous, let him be righteous still: and he that is holy, let him be holy still.” Revelation 22:11

 We find in Testimonies for the Church, vol. 5, Page 216 :
“It is now that we must keep ourselves and our children unspotted from the world. It is now that we must wash our robes of character and make them white in the blood of the Lamb. It is now that we must overcome pride, passion, and spiritual slothfulness....What are you doing, brethren, in the great work of preparation?..Those who are distrustful of self, who are humbling themselves before God and purifying their souls by obeying the truth these are receiving the heavenly mold and preparing for the seal of God in their foreheads. When the decree goes forth and the stamp is impressed, their character will remain pure and spotless for eternity. {5T 216.1}

 In Revelation 3:21 Christ makes a promise to the church of Laodicea. “To him who overcomes I will grant to sit with Me on My throne, as I also overcame and sat down with My Father on His throne” (Revelation 3:21).

 So these saints that live at the end during the time such as never was must not only overcome, but perfect and just like Job to go through a unimaginable trial, and be ready to stand pure and spotless without a mediator with their robes washed in the blood of the lamb to prove to the universe that fallen human beings can keep the law of God.

 95 
 on: January 15, 2017, 02:47:21 AM 
Started by reddogs - Last post by reddogs
We came across the question of the 144,000 and the Great Multitude which No One Could Number. It cause some issues as we struggled with it as the Adventist view is not clearly laid out and Ellen White held back for reasons which will become clear.


 We have the following views in Adventism:

 1. That these two groups of people are one and the same. However, I find some problems with this:

 Issues with this view.
 A. The 144,000 is specifically named from the 12 tribes of Israel (Revelation 7:4) however, the Great Multitude comes from All Nations (Revelation 7:9)

 B. The Great Multitude Could Not be Numbered (Revelation 7:9), however, 144,000 is a Numbered People (Revelation 7:4)

 C. The 144,000 is specifically said to be those that "washed their robes and made them white in the blood of the Lamb",(Revelation 7:14), "Virgins", and "were redeemed from among men, being first fruits to God and to the Lamb" (Revelation 14).


 2. That the 144,000 are just symbolic

 The issue with this is fairly straightforward.
 A. Why give a specific number if its symbolic.

 B. Why separate them from the Great Multitude which No One Could Number, why not just leave it at that.

 3. That the 144,000 are those that are living and the 'first fruits' raised up to meet Him when Christ comes, and the dead saints in the grave are resurrected and both join in the air and then taken to heaven.

 Lets go over it and see what we find:

First the Remnant.

 According to Revelation, at the end there will be a people who have certain characteristics, they keep the commandments of God (Rev 12:17; 14:12) and they have the testimony of Jesus (Rev. 12:17). We know them as the remnant, but there is also another end time group given, the 144,000.

 Now Ellen White counseled that the identity of the 144,000 was not a question to allow division.: Ellen White in 1901 wrote: “It is not His [God’s] will that they shall get into controversy over questions which will not help them spiritually, such as, Who is to compose the hundred and forty-four thousand? This those who are the elect of God will in a short time know without question.” [Ellen G. White, Selected Messages, book 1, p. 174.]The word “controversy” gives us a hint of what she was arguing against, and its clear that it will be made evident at the end to Gods elect.


Now the Church Militant and the Church triumphant.
 Lets read Daniel 12:1

“And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book.” Daniel 12:1

 So we have a remnant who are a commandment keeping people who have the testimony of Jesus Christ. But this remnant must go through the tribulation and “the time of trouble, such as never”.

We have the following in SOP Counsels for the Church, Page 240:
“God has a church upon the earth who are His chosen people, who keep His commandments. He is leading, not stray offshoots, not one here and one there, but a people. The truth is a sanctifying power; but the church militant is not the church triumphant. There are tares among the wheat. “Wilt thou then that we ... gather them up?” was the question of the servant; but the master answered, “Nay; lest while ye gather up the tares, ye root up also the wheat with them.” The gospel net draws not only good fish, but bad ones as well, and the Lord only knows who are His. CCh 240.1”

In the Great Controversy page 623, Ellen White has some very specific descriptions of those who stand at the end while Christ still intercedes in the Most Holy Place:

“Now, while our great High Priest is making the atonement for us, we should seek to become perfect in Christ. Not even by a thought could our Saviour be brought to yield to the power of temptation. Satan finds in human hearts some point where he can gain a foothold; some sinful desire is cherished, by means of which his temptations assert their power. But Christ declared of Himself: "The prince of this world cometh, and hath nothing in Me." John 14:30. Satan could find nothing in the Son of God that would enable him to gain the victory. He had kept His Father's commandments, and there was no sin in Him that Satan could use to his advantage. This is the condition in which those must be found who shall stand in the time of trouble. “{GC 623.1}

 So we have a church who are not all Gods people, composed of two groups, the true followers of God and others whose hearts and minds are not cleansed and ready for Christ, this is the church militant. So the church itself must go through a shaking in which those on the side of Satan will be taken out, the tares will be separated from the wheat, and the people who are His, prepared to be the church triumphant.

 We find in John 6:27 it tells us:
“Labour not for the meat which perisheth, but for that meat which endureth unto everlasting life, which the Son of man shall give unto you: for him hath God the Father sealed.” John 6:27

 We also find in 2 Corinthians 1:21-23
“21 Now he which stablisheth us with you in Christ, and hath anointed us, is God;22 Who hath also sealed us, and given the earnest of the Spirit in our hearts”

So the saints throughout the ages have been sealed, and we also need prepare to be sealed, SOP tells us in Testimonies for the Church, vol. 5, Page 216 :

“Now is the time to prepare. The seal of God will never be placed upon the forehead of an impure man or woman. It will never be placed upon the forehead of the ambitious, world-loving man or woman. It will never be placed upon the forehead of men or women of false tongues or deceitful hearts. All who receive the seal must be without spot before God -- candidates for heaven..” {5T 216.2}

 96 
 on: December 04, 2016, 10:29:44 AM 
Started by daylily - Last post by Bob Pickle
Not everyone would be able to answer it, and I think the first paragraph of what you pasted makes clear that Linda doesn't know how to. That's fine. But I think she might be able to give us the name of the machine.

 97 
 on: December 02, 2016, 04:36:15 PM 
Started by daylily - Last post by Daryl Fawcett
Perhaps Linda Shelton can answer your question.

 98 
 on: November 26, 2016, 04:17:41 AM 
Started by reddogs - Last post by reddogs
Hillary was all but set to be elected as President according to the pollsters, the pundits, the newscasts and other news sources, and yet something happened to turn aside what appeared to a unstoppable assured victory. How could it have happened, and why, well lets take a look to see.


"Mrs. Clinton appears to have converted the office of secretary of state into a racketeering enterprise...Hillary and her husband, former president Bill Clinton, operated the Clinton Foundation. Ostensibly a charity, the foundation was a de facto fraud scheme to monetize Hillary’s power as secretary of state (among other aspects of the Clintons’ political influence). The scheme involved (a) the exchange of political favors, access, and influence for millions of dollars in donations; (b) the circumvention of campaign-finance laws that prohibit political donations by foreign sources; (c) a vehicle for Mrs. Clinton to shield her State Department e-mail communications from public and congressional scrutiny while she and her husband exploited the fundraising potential of her position; and (d) a means for Clinton insiders to receive private-sector compensation and explore lucrative employment opportunities while drawing taxpayer-funded government salaries.".. http://www.nationalreview.com/article/441573/

Bill and Hillary's corruption was not the only issue, read below:

http://www.despatch.cth.com.au/Misc/famous_2.htm
•Bill Clinton, 33rd Degree Freemason, President of the United States Of America.

and more...

•Bill and Hillary Clinton's Criminal Background.


https://americanmediainstitute.com/inves...CFZNZhgodMBsPiw
•The Clinton Foundation


http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/arch...enghazi/396182/
•From Whitewater to Benghazi: A Clinton-Scandal Primer

 99 
 on: November 18, 2016, 12:15:20 PM 
Started by daylily - Last post by Bob Pickle
I would like to know more. What is the name of the machine that measures the frequencies? What are the specific frequencies we are talking about?

Back in 1997 someone sent me a plastic water-filled disk that was said to use quantum mechanics and water-structuring technology such that if you put it in your washer, you didn't need detergent, saving lots of money. You could buy these disks at a discount and make money by reselling them.

Knowing something about quantum mechanics, I was skeptical. So I conducted experiments to see whether the disk would emulsify fats and lower the surface tension of water. It didn't.

I took Crisco and cayenne pepper, mixed them together, and worked that stuff into three socks. I then washed three loads, with only one sock in each load. One load used detergent. One used the disk. And one used plain water. The result? The disk worked as well as plain water, which means that the socks came out of those two loads still dirty.

As long as you didn't wash anything greasy, your clothes would probably come fairly clean, which would make it appear that the disk worked.

Another example is water witching. I have been told that water witching works because of magnetism or electricity. Yet some water witchers use sticks, and sticks don't conduct electricity and aren't affected by magnetism. For those who use brass rods instead of sticks, magnetism doesn't affect brass either. And if the cause is really electricity, passing them over the hood of one's car should cause them to move as well.

So I would like to learn more. I've been hearing about this equipment for awhile, but I have no idea what it is, and couldn't tell anyone what it is if I were asked, or where to get one from.

Even though we are fearfully and wonderfully made, and some things about the body are impossible to fully explain even today, we ought to be to explain the basics about this machine and what it is doing.

 100 
 on: November 13, 2016, 08:03:24 AM 
Started by daylily - Last post by Daryl Fawcett
Linda Shelton posted the following on Facebook on October 12, 2016:

Question: Can you explain how a light bulb makes light? Can you explain how pictures and sound come from a television? How about the telephone? Radio? A computer? Undoubtedly, there are inventions on our planet where we appreciate what they can do, but we could not begin to explain how they work.

Many remember that Emberly Benton Blake was not only diagnosed last May with Glioblastoma (cancer of the brain), but she also had surgery removing a portion of her brain, as well as the cancer. The rest of the cancer, the specialist labeled as in-operable. Since I was aware of Dr. Arild Abrahamsen's success with various cancers, I alerted the family as to the type of technology that he had to offer. Amazingly, they decided to 'take the plunge' and fly to Norway, while understanding that the clock was ticking for Emberly (by traditional medicine standards.) After two months of IV treatments, his equipment indicated her cancer was gone. This dedicated Seventh-day Adventist doctor gives the glory to God.

I have personally benefitted from these treatments. I speak of this more in my book, 'Adventures in Forgiveness.' Although the technology is similar to television, radio, a computer, etc., in that it is impossible to easily explain it in lay terms, I thought I would at least offer my humble views of this amazing technology for those of you who have questions as to how this may have occurred.

When a patient, like Emberly, comes to his office, she does not find alot of stainless steel equipment, a large staff of uniformed assistants or even a large, modern clinic. To the contrary, one enters a simple office with a computer, a large computer screen along with some smaller pieces of equipment. Rather than gathering information with blood tests or xrays, the information is gathered by the equipment and the doctor by reading and analyzing the frequencies of the organs. (Amazingly, similar technology is used today by mechanics to detect problems in cars and trucks.) Incredibly accurate information can be gathered in this manner in a very small amount of time. The problems of the patient are not only identified by the indications of the frequencies, but also the remedies needed to counteract the problems are also indicated. This removes much of the guess work out of working to help the patient recover from the problems. Dr. Abrahamsen uses no drugs. He uses condensed and sterile liquid forms of vitamins, minerals and natural substances like iodine, dmae and dmso. These substances rarely, if ever, have side effects. Additionally, when these simple remedies are combined, they become mega miracle workers! Wow!

We are living in an age where today the most powerful sources of technology use frequencies...like television, radio, Wifi, cell phones. Even today's weapons use radiation and electromagnetic frequencies. And now the technology in medicine is using frequencies as well.

Since Emberly's case was extremely severe, Initially Dr. Abrahamsen tested and treated her on a daily basis. He followed the indicators of his equipment as to the remedies given to her by IV fluid. As time went on, the treatments were reduced to every other day. In about two months, his equipment indicated the cancer was gone.

The newspaper articles in Norway refer to Dr. Abrahamsen as 'the miracle doctor.' They refer to his methods being 20 years ahead of his time. He will often receive the patients that traditional doctors send home to die. He successfully treats, not only those afflicted with life-threatening diseases, but he treats famous athletes, even those who have been included in the Olympics. His treatments help them perform at their best, using no drugs. But Dr. Abrahamsen is not interested in worldly acclaim, yet in my opinion, his work should be recognized, applauded and developed to where more people can have access to it. Over the years I have written and talked to physicians and people who, one would think, would be interested. Strangely, no one seemed to want to 'jump in.' Does anyone know Bill Gates? He's the next one on my list. Please pray that a breakthrough can be found here... And PRAISE GOD for this incredible technology that saves lives!!

By the way, Emberly and Jason, her husband, arrived safely to their home in California yesterday. According to her doctor in California, she was not supposed to be alive today. They are praising God for her invigorated strength and healing. She looks and feels great!

Pages: 1 ... 8 9 [10]