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[Johann]

It seems to me that we need the Holy Spirit to guide our thinking and to clarify our words that we may understand each other.

It seems to me that Ellen White makes a statement that it is more important that we seek to be among the 144,000 than being able to define who they are. So what are we doing here?

[tinka]

Yes, I agree ...but the subject with wrong understanding about drove me out of the belief realizing that I could never be of that number on the sea of glass in that literal number, and caused me to be devastated. But before I left the church I felt I must see for my self of which took a lot of years of study only to finally realize that it was exactly as simple as God's History book to show how great another way was to pull in the redeemed by human instrument made possible by His sacrifice.

 When I realized this I was so grateful and then settled down to realize the 144,000 did not make one iota of a difference who it was except the purpose of it to bring in the last era of forgotten sabbath keepers that could be saved "with" the 144,000 chosen of God to be sealed with His last message at end times.-- many as the sand of the sea had the chance to enter instead of a bumper system. You have no idea what that did to me years ago. It was more then devastation! It was horror for me.  Why should I live- sort of thing.   So yes, I had to find out every smidge I could after discovering, with every word. Now you might see why I am so thankful that Jesus had a last message and Mrs. White complied. I had to read every word and artilce then realized she was for real and God did love us enough and did not forget we still needed more guidence( in this era of time). An SDA made me feel the way I discribed above.

 It turned out to be a simple understanding after that but never could ever understand the church keeping away from it and then be divided on it. Then I heard another pastor from another denomination that did not keep the sabbath and it was shocking to me to hear him preach exactly this scenario after what I felt the Holy Spirit help me find on my own . I do think it is important to understand it's signifiance or place in the Redemption of the Redeemed and the extent that God Loved His people so much that He sacrificed and did all He could and that is what the signifiance did for me.  Then my lack of self-control (laugh) works when I feel I have to protect this kind of love. It's worse then a mother hen (smile) so maybe I won't make it after all. But I really do want to and see Him.

[Laodicea]

The following are excerpts posted by AmazingGrace that I have taken time to make comments on:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>" Where is the evidence that the judgment of the living has begun?  “
”The image of the beast Sunday law will be formed before probation closes; for it is to be the great test for the people of God, by which their eternal destiny will be decided....  This is the test that the people of God must have before they are sealed."Maranatha, p. 164 ‘ I'm not too familiar with Ernie's "dreams," but one that I read had a scene in which God's people were being guillotined.  Seems like Ernie is reading "Left Behind" books or anti-government propaganda.’  " A decree will FINALLY be issued against those who hallow the Sabbath of the fourth commandment, denouncing them as deserving of the severest punishment and giving the people liberty, after a certain time, to put them to death."
“I'm not too familiar with Ernie's "dreams," but one that I read had a scene in which God's people were being guillotined.  Seems like Ernie is reading "Left Behind" books or anti-government propaganda.  The death decree by the government will not be passed until after probation has closed, and then, none of God's people will be killed.  So at what time does Ernie's dream place the guillotine scene?  Before probation closes?   Would the government be beheading the saints before probation closes, and then, after probation closes, decide, "Duh, we need to pass a death decree."  Ridiculous.”<<<<<<<<<<<<<<




Part of the above is an excerpt from a compilation of Ellen G Whites writing.  Maranatha is a devotional.  Let’s be careful to keep all we read in its proper context.   Pertaining to  “The people of God”  which are to be sealed, EGW was referring to the people of God excluding the 144,000.  If she had meant the 144,000, she would have stated so.  The 144,000 are to be sealed prior to this and do a special work to get the people of God ready to face the great test.  The 144,000 are to start THE LOUD CRY.  Once the great test comes, it will be too late to prepare if you haven’t been doing so already.  YOU WILL BE SWEPT AWAY BY THE GREAT TORRENT THAT IS SOON TO COME!
Of all the faithful Christians, only the 144,000 will survive through the close of probation and the pouring out of all 7 plagues.  I can show you this in EGW writings and the bible- I have studied and continue to study BOTH.  However, my preference is the BIBLE, as was EGW’s, for her writings are the “Lesser Light”.  All others will be laid to rest prior to the pouring out of all of the 7 plagues from various modes, one of which is martyrdom------Proof:  “And they cried with a loud voice saying, How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou not JUDGE (referring to the final judgment) and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth?  And white robes were given unto every one of them; and it was said unto them, that they should rest yet for a LITTLE SEASON----UNTIL---their fellow servants also and their brethren, that should be killed as they were, should be fulfilled.” Rev 6:10-11  “…Blessed are the dead which die in the Lord from henceforth: Yea, saith the Spirit, that they may rest from their labors; and their works do follow them.” Rev 14:13 After probation closes, no man may work, for the “day” will be spent and the night will be here, “wherein no man may work” John 9:4.   So Rev 14:13 refers to those who die prior to the close of probation.  In Revelation 13, the image to the beast is already made---“And (the lamblike beast)  deceiveth them that dwell on the earth by the means of those miracles which he had power to do in the sight of the beast; saying to them that dwell on the earth, that they should make an image to the beast, which had the wound by a sword, and did live.” Rev 13:14 So we can therefore conclude that people will die after the image is made to the beast- as the bible shows us.  The word of God explains itself- it doesn’t need our help.
Maranatha p.268:
“I saw that the four angels would hold the four winds until Jesus' work
was done in the sanctuary, and then will come the seven last plagues.
These plagues enraged the wicked against the righteous; they thought
that we had brought the judgments of God upon them, and that if they
could rid the earth of us, the plagues would then be stayed. A decree
went forth to slay the saints, which caused them to cry day and night
for deliverance. This was the time of Jacob's trouble…”

”… Though a general decree has fixed the time when commandment keepers may
be put to death, their enemies will in some cases anticipate the decree,
and before the time specified, will endeavor to take their lives. But
none can pass the mighty guardians stationed about every faithful soul.
Some are assailed in their flight from the cities and villages; but the
swords raised against them break and fall powerless as a straw. Others
are defended by angels in the form of men of war.”

Note: The only saints who live through this are the 144,000, which EGW refers to as a LITERAL NUMBER- THIS THE BIBLE ALSO SUPPORTS.  The 144,000 will not taste of death.  So the evil people, including “lukewarm” SDA’s who will be given over to reprobate minds, who will seek their death will be confounded.  The other saints of God prior to the 7 plagues will taste of death- to reiterate- from causes including martyrdom- as proven by Rev 6 and 14 together.


Concerning the judgment of the living, if you don’t know what time it is, I feel sorry for you.

THE DAY IS FAR SPENT AND THE NIGHT COMETH.  SEEK GOD (DAILY) AND LIVE, FOR WHY SHOULD ONE DIE.

With Love,

Laodicea

Tinka,

Read through the highlighted quote above carefully and then read the reiteration below.

"Although there will be women and children in the post-probation remnant, the 144,000 males are the ones that God counts." 

Question: Were there a literal 12 disciples whom Jesus hand-picked?  Did God make the world in literally 6 days?  Why must we continue to trivialize the bible?  Were there really only 8 people in the whole world who survived the worldwide flood?...  Are there literally 12000 males of each of 12 tribes, not counting the saved women and children, who will be alive during the 7 plagues and see Jesus come in the clouds?

The answers- yes, yes, unbelief, yes and yes

With Love,

Laodicea
[/quote]

Yes, I agree ...but the subject with wrong understanding about drove me out of the belief realizing that I could never be of that number on the sea of glass in that literal number, and caused me to be devastated. But before I left the church I felt I must see for my self of which took a lot of years of study only to finally realize that it was exactly as simple as God's History book to show how great another way was to pull in the redeemed by human instrument made possible by His sacrifice.

 When I realized this I was so grateful and then settled down to realize the 144,000 did not make one iota of a difference who it was except the purpose of it to bring in the last era of forgotten sabbath keepers that could be saved "with" the 144,000 chosen of God to be sealed with His last message at end times.-- many as the sand of the sea had the chance to enter instead of a bumper system. You have no idea what that did to me years ago. It was more then devastation! It was horror for me.  Why should I live- sort of thing.   So yes, I had to find out every smidge I could after discovering, with every word. Now you might see why I am so thankful that Jesus had a last message and Mrs. White complied. I had to read every word and artilce then realized she was for real and God did love us enough and did not forget we still needed more guidence( in this era of time). An SDA made me feel the way I discribed above.

 It turned out to be a simple understanding after that but never could ever understand the church keeping away from it and then be divided on it. Then I heard another pastor from another denomination that did not keep the sabbath and it was shocking to me to hear him preach exactly this scenario after what I felt the Holy Spirit help me find on my own . I do think it is important to understand it's signifiance or place in the Redemption of the Redeemed and the extent that God Loved His people so much that He sacrificed and did all He could and that is what the signifiance did for me.  Then my lack of self-control (laugh) works when I feel I have to protect this kind of love. It's worse then a mother hen (smile) so maybe I won't make it after all. But I really do want to and see Him.

Hmmm, I am being misquoted, unfortunately.  Yes, Tinka, carefully go over my original quotes.  I DID NOT say that the 144,000 and the other saints will be sealed after the National Day of Rest (or whatever label you want to put on it) Law is passed.
You have mistaken the midnight cry for the Loud Cry.  See reference below.
Review and Herald, March 3, 1885, Advent Experience--No. 4
‘…When the midnight cry ended and the time passed, they felt that the last great test was reached. This was the universal feeling at the time. Their intense burden for souls had ceased. The Satanic spirit around them made the matter still more clear to their minds.
After the time passed, Mr. Miller in another letter addressed to Elder Himes says:
"We have done our work in warning sinners and in trying to awaken a formal church. God in His providence has shut the door. We can only stir one another up to be patient and to be diligent to make our calling and election sure. We are now living in the time specified in Malachi 8:18 (also Dan. 12:20, Rev. 22:10-12).
"In this passage we cannot help but see that a little while before Christ should come, there would be a separation be- tween the just and the unjust, between the righteous and the wicked, between those who love his appearing and those who hate it. And never since the days of the apostles has there been such a division line drawn as was drawn about the time of the seventh Jewish month. Since that time they say they have no confidence in us. We have need of patience after we have done the will of God, that we may receive the promise…."’

The “midnight cry” is what took place in Ellen White’s time, NOT THE LOUD CRY.  The midnight cry is connected to the 2300 day prophecy….The Loud Cry Takes place after the Latter Rain is poured out by Jehovah, which will happen shortly.  Refer to the EGW quote below.

Relationship of Health to a Spiritual Mission.  Chapter 25
Preparation for the latter rain and the loud cry.
‘ This application of health principles is profound and distinctively an Adventist insight. Ellen White wrote in 1867: “God’s people are not prepared for the loud cry of the third angel. They have a work to do for themselves which they should not leave for God to do for them. . . . Lustful appetite makes slaves of men and women, and beclouds their intellects and stupefies their moral sensibilities to such a degree that the sacred, elevated truths of God’s Word are not appreciated. . . . In order to be fitted for translation, the people of God must know themselves. . . . They should ever have the appetite in subjection to the moral and intellectual organs.”22’

Be encouraged.   The 144,000 are not loved more than any other of the faithful children of God.  The 144,000 are to do a special work. The 144,000 and all of the other saved souls that were ever born on God’s green earth constitute the great multitude!  So again, be encouraged.  I present these messages to inform and I will try my best to make the message clear.  If you thought that only the 144,000 would be saved of all the endtime living- I’m so sorry you thought that.  Because this is not so.  Many will be convinced to accept the truth right before the close of probation and be saved- in the “11th hour”.  They will be saved, but yet not go through the time of trouble.  Just as the gates of hell did not prevail against our savior, Jesus, the gates of hell (hades or the grave) will not prevail against the saints of God who will sleep through the time of trouble. 

Happy Studies!

-Laodicea

[tinka]

The following are excerpts posted by AmazingGrace that I have taken time to make comments on:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>" Where is the evidence that the judgment of the living has begun?  “
”The image of the beast Sunday law will be formed before probation closes; for it is to be the great test for the people of God, by which their eternal destiny will be decided....  This is the test that the people of God must have before they are sealed."Maranatha, p. 164 ‘ I'm not too familiar with Ernie's "dreams," but one that I read had a scene in which God's people were being guillotined.  Seems like Ernie is reading "Left Behind" books or anti-government propaganda.’  " A decree will FINALLY be issued against those who hallow the Sabbath of the fourth commandment, denouncing them as deserving of the severest punishment and giving the people liberty, after a certain time, to put them to death."
“I'm not too familiar with Ernie's "dreams," but one that I read had a scene in which God's people were being guillotined.  Seems like Ernie is reading "Left Behind" books or anti-government propaganda.  The death decree by the government will not be passed until after probation has closed, and then, none of God's people will be killed.  So at what time does Ernie's dream place the guillotine scene?  Before probation closes?   Would the government be beheading the saints before probation closes, and then, after probation closes, decide, "Duh, we need to pass a death decree."  Ridiculous.”<<<<<<<<<<<<<<




Part of the above is an excerpt from a compilation of Ellen G Whites writing.  Maranatha is a devotional.  Let’s be careful to keep all we read in its proper context.   Pertaining to  “The people of God”  which are to be sealed, EGW was referring to the people of God excluding the 144,000.  If she had meant the 144,000, she would have stated so.  The 144,000 are to be sealed prior to this and do a special work to get the people of God ready to face the great test.  The 144,000 are to start THE LOUD CRY. I understand the Midnight Cry and the Disappointment, but as a whole I believed The Loud Cry started at the beginning of the 3rd angels message and would swell with HOly Spirit to finality. I did not believe the Loud Cry did not happen yet) Once the great test comes, (Mark of the Beast or Sabbath Test ?) it will be too late to prepare if you haven’t been doing so already. (How will the last hour ones be saved then?) YOU WILL BE SWEPT AWAY BY THE GREAT TORRENT THAT IS SOON TO COME!
Of all the faithful Christians, only the 144,000 will survive through the close of probation and the pouring out of all 7 plagues.  I can show you this in EGW writings and the bible- I have studied and continue to study BOTH.  However, my preference is the BIBLE, as was EGW’s, for her writings are the “Lesser Light”.  All others will be laid to rest prior to the pouring out of all of the 7 plagues from various modes, one of which is martyrdom------Proof:  “And they cried with a loud voice saying, How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou not JUDGE (referring to the final judgment) and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth?  (Now here is where I understood differently about this scenario. I believed these were referring to the era of persecution of the christians, Waldenceas and they were the ones that were continuing to cry out but still their brethern were going to be killed yet in THAT era of time.  They were the martyers that are discribed standing nearest the throne. )And white robes were given unto every one of them; and it was said unto them, that they should rest yet for a LITTLE SEASON----UNTIL---their fellow servants also and their brethren, that should be killed as they were, should be fulfilled.” Rev 6:10-11  “ Yes, that time or era was fulfilled and that is the way I took that to mean and no time did I think that meant for our time.…Blessed are the dead which die in the Lord from henceforth: (This could or can mean from all eras of earth's time.)Yea, saith the Spirit, that they may rest from their labors; and their works do follow them.” Rev 14:13 After probation closes, no man may work, for the “day” will be spent and the night will be here, “wherein no man may work” John 9:4. (How is it that I understood this to mean that once probation closes, there is no need for the christians work for souls. But in that statement is says NO MAN may work so all are dead but the 144,000?  So Rev 14:13 refers to those who die prior to the close of probation. (I never took that verse ever once to mean that scenario. I took it to mean that Blessed are those that their works do follow them after their death in all generations.) In Revelation 13, the image to the beast is already made---“And (the lamblike beast)  deceiveth them that dwell on the earth by the means of those miracles which he had power to do in the sight of the beast; saying to them that dwell on the earth, that they should make an image to the beast, which had the wound by a sword, and did live.” Rev 13:14 So we can therefore conclude that people will die after the image is made to the beast- as the bible shows us.  The word of God explains itself- it doesn’t need our help. But I thought that is why we were told to flee to the mountains.Maranatha p.268:
“I saw that the four angels would hold the four winds until Jesus' work
was done in the sanctuary, and then will come the seven last plagues.
These plagues enraged the wicked against the righteous; the righteous or are you referring to the 144,000 her are the ones still living right?they thought
that we had brought the judgments of God upon them, and that if they
could rid the earth of us, the plagues would then be stayed. A decree
went forth to slay the saints, which caused them to cry day and night
for deliverance. This was the time of Jacob's trouble…” This part I realize”… Though a general decree has fixed the time when commandment keepers may
be put to death, their enemies will in some cases anticipate the decree,
and before the time specified, will endeavor to take their lives. But
none can pass the mighty guardians stationed about every faithful soul.
Some are assailed in their flight from the cities and villages; but the
swords raised against them break and fall powerless as a straw. Others
are defended by angels in the form of men of war.”

Note: The only saints who live through this are the 144,000, which EGW refers to as a LITERAL NUMBER- THIS THE BIBLE ALSO SUPPORTS.  The 144,000 Here I recall the righteous will not taste of death.  So the evil people, including “lukewarm” SDA’s who will be given over to reprobate minds, who will seek their death will be confounded.  The other saints of God prior to the 7 plagues will taste of death- to reiterate- from causes including martyrdom- as proven by Rev 6 and 14 together. This is the part I am not really so sure of since many will be hidden when fleeing to mountains and are hidden.
Concerning the judgment of the living, if you don’t know what time it is, I feel sorry for you.

THE DAY IS FAR SPENT AND THE NIGHT COMETH.  SEEK GOD (DAILY) AND LIVE, FOR WHY SHOULD ONE DIE.

With Love,

Laodicea

Tinka,

Read through the highlighted quote above carefully and then read the reiteration below.

"Although there will be women and children in the post-probation remnant, the 144,000 males are the ones that God counts."  I would definitely have to see something more pertaing to this as this is the first time ever I heard of just males being the 144,000. Otherwise then women do not need to quite eating meat to be translated without seeing death as advised. Just not sure about this (smile).
Question: Were there a literal 12 disciples whom Jesus hand-picked?  Did God make the world in literally 6 days?  Why must we continue to trivialize the bible?  Were there really only 8 people in the whole world who survived the worldwide flood?...  Are there literally 12000 males of each of 12 tribes, not counting the saved women and children, who will be alive during the 7 plagues and see Jesus come in the clouds?
So are you then stating here that there will be women and children along "wit" the 144,000 but not counted?The answers- yes, yes, unbelief, yes and yes

With Love,

Laodicea

Yes, I agree ...but the subject with wrong understanding about drove me out of the belief realizing that I could never be of that number on the sea of glass in that literal number, and caused me to be devastated. But before I left the church I felt I must see for my self of which took a lot of years of study only to finally realize that it was exactly as simple as God's History book to show how great another way was to pull in the redeemed by human instrument made possible by His sacrifice.

 When I realized this I was so grateful and then settled down to realize the 144,000 did not make one iota of a difference who it was except the purpose of it to bring in the last era of forgotten sabbath keepers that could be saved "with" the 144,000 chosen of God to be sealed with His last message at end times.-- many as the sand of the sea had the chance to enter instead of a bumper system. You have no idea what that did to me years ago. It was more then devastation! It was horror for me.  Why should I live- sort of thing.   So yes, I had to find out every smidge I could after discovering, with every word. Now you might see why I am so thankful that Jesus had a last message and Mrs. White complied. I had to read every word and artilce then realized she was for real and God did love us enough and did not forget we still needed more guidence( in this era of time). An SDA made me feel the way I discribed above.

 It turned out to be a simple understanding after that but never could ever understand the church keeping away from it and then be divided on it. Then I heard another pastor from another denomination that did not keep the sabbath and it was shocking to me to hear him preach exactly this scenario after what I felt the Holy Spirit help me find on my own . I do think it is important to understand it's signifiance or place in the Redemption of the Redeemed and the extent that God Loved His people so much that He sacrificed and did all He could and that is what the signifiance did for me.  Then my lack of self-control (laugh) works when I feel I have to protect this kind of love. It's worse then a mother hen (smile) so maybe I won't make it after all. But I really do want to and see Him.

Hmmm, I am being misquoted, unfortunately.  Yes, Tinka, carefully go over my original quotes.  I DID NOT say that the 144,000 and the other saints will be sealed after the National Day of Rest (or whatever label you want to put on it) Law is passed.
You have mistaken the midnight cry for the Loud Cry.  See reference below.
Review and Herald, March 3, 1885, Advent Experience--No. 4
‘…When the midnight cry ended and the time passed, they felt that the last great test was reached. This was the universal feeling at the time. Their intense burden for souls had ceased. The Satanic spirit around them made the matter still more clear to their minds.
After the time passed, Mr. Miller in another letter addressed to Elder Himes says:
"We have done our work in warning sinners and in trying to awaken a formal church. God in His providence has shut the door. We can only stir one another up to be patient and to be diligent to make our calling and election sure. We are now living in the time specified in Malachi 8:18 (also Dan. 12:20, Rev. 22:10-12).
"In this passage we cannot help but see that a little while before Christ should come, there would be a separation be- tween the just and the unjust, between the righteous and the wicked, between those who love his appearing and those who hate it. And never since the days of the apostles has there been such a division line drawn as was drawn about the time of the seventh Jewish month. Since that time they say they have no confidence in us. We have need of patience after we have done the will of God, that we may receive the promise…."’

The “midnight cry” is what took place in Ellen White’s time, NOT THE LOUD CRY.  The midnight cry is connected to the 2300 day prophecy….The Loud Cry Takes place after the Latter Rain is poured out by Jehovah, which will happen shortly.  Refer to the EGW quote below.

Relationship of Health to a Spiritual Mission.  Chapter 25
Preparation for the latter rain and the loud cry.
‘ This application of health principles is profound and distinctively an Adventist insight. Ellen White wrote in 1867: “God’s people are not prepared for the loud cry of the third angel. (Now here is where it calls the Loud Cry at the 3rd angels message as I read it)They have a work to do for themselves which they should not leave for God to do for them. . . . Lustful appetite makes slaves of men and women, and beclouds their intellects and stupefies their moral sensibilities to such a degree that the sacred, elevated truths of God’s Word are not appreciated. . . . In order to be fitted for translation, the people of God must know themselves. . . . They should ever have the appetite in subjection to the moral and intellectual organs.”22’

Be encouraged.   The 144,000 are not loved more than any other of the faithful children of God.  The 144,000 are to do a special work. The 144,000 and all of the other saved souls that were ever born on God’s green earth constitute the great multitude!  So again, be encouraged.  I present these messages to inform and I will try my best to make the message clear.  If you thought that only the 144,000 would be saved of all the endtime living- I’m so sorry you thought that.  Because this is not so.  Many will be convinced to accept the truth right before the close of probation and be saved- in the “11th hour”.  They will be saved, but yet not go through the time of trouble.  Just as the gates of hell did not prevail against our savior, Jesus, the gates of hell (hades or the grave) will not prevail against the saints of God who will sleep through the time of trouble.Where do I find this quote "sleep through the time of trouble"    I took this to mean all saints from generations of different tribulationsHappy Studies! I am not a good speaker but a good reader at least always got an A and feel quite amazed at the difference of understanding from different views. Did God let me believe a lie with all the years of study? He promised He would not do this if I was sincere and I do not know how to be more sincere as my time of years seems to be up. This is quite a head banger for me.Hope I got all in order of comments here and did not mess yours up
-Laodicea

[/quote]

I have also a very hard time doing the quotes in the right areas. I cannot tell your highlights of where you did that from here. But will try to comment within your posts.

[Laodicea]

Your answers are in the bible.  You can't just read Ellen Whites writings and get clear understanding on this.  God, by His Spirit, can show you where to find these answers.


Title: "The Latter Rain Produces The Loud Cry"

"At that time the latter rain, or refreshing from the presence of the Lord, will come, to give power to the loud voice of the third angel (Rev 18, not Rev 14), and prepare the saints to stand in the period when the seven last plagues shall be poured out."  
Ref- Last Day Events, page 186.

The Loud Cry comes from the angel that unites with the 3rd angel as seem in Rev 18.  
"Let the latter rain come into my vessel.  Let the light of the glorious angel which unites with the third angel shine upon me; give me a part in the work; let me sound the proclamation; let me be a colaborer with Jesus Christ...."  Last Day Events, pg 194

As pertaining to Rev 18, EW writes- "This scripture points FORWARD to a time when the announcement of the fall of Babylon, as made by the second angel of Revelation 14:8, is to be repeated, with the additional mention of the corruptions which have been entering the various organizations that constitute Babylon, since that message was first given, in the summer of 1844...These announcements, uniting with the third angel's message, constitute the final warning to be given to the inhabitants of the world..." Last Day Events pg 202

"I saw that this message will close with power and strength far exceeding the midnight cry."  Last Day Events, pg 202

"To souls that are earnestly seeking for LIGHT and that accept with gladness every ray of divine illumination from His Holy Word, to such alone light WILL BE given.  It is through these souls that God WILL REVEAL that light  and power which WILL LIGHTEN the whole earth with His glory."       Last Day Events, p 205

THERE IS TO BE IN THE [SEVENTH DAY ADVENTIST] CHURCHES A WONDERFUL MANIFESTATION OF THE POWER OF GOD, BUT IT WILL NOT MOVE UPON THOSE WHO HAVE NOT HUMBLED THEMSELVES BEFORE THE LORD, AND OPENED THE DOOR OF THE HEART BY CONFESSION AND REPENTANCE.  IN THE MANIFESTATION OF THAT POWER WHICH LIGHTENS THE EARTH WITH THE GLORY OF GOD, THEY WILL SEE ONLY SOMETHING WHICH IN THEIR BLINDNESS THEY THINK DANGEROUS, SOMETHING WHICH WILL AROUSE THEIR FEARS, AND THEY WILL BRACE THEMSELVES TO RESIST IT.       BECAUSE THE LORD DOES NOT WORK ACCORDING TO THEIR IDEAS AND EXPECTATIONS THEY WILL OPPOSE THE WORK."  LDE PG 210


More To Come.

-Laodicea

[Master Spud]

Ernie Knoll has quite a following, especially when there is messages concering Ed Reid, Angel Rodriguez, Steve Wohlberg, Eugene Prewit, David Gates, Vance Ferrell, Linda Kirk, Laura Lee Jones.










edited to remove website address - those interested can find it elsewhere.

[Master Spud]

Ernie Knoll has had visions that are relative to the end times of this earth.












edited to remove website address - those interested can find it elsewhere.

[Bob Pickle]

Ernie Knoll has had visions that are relative to the end times of this earth.

Didn't Ernie admit that he lied?







edited to remove website address - those interested can find it elsewhere.

[tinka]

With lackness of starting at the beginning of this thread and understanding where all this was coming from and just plain jumping in at a one time look, then commenting in lackness my attention was now drawn in to see what all this was about. Who is Ernie Knoll? I did not even realize the title of the thread because I noticed first 144,000 and it has been a personal interest to study about it. I have studied it on a personal basis and never with someone. Now I go back to the beginning as my eye catches this "Vision" thing. So here is a new web site. Now my interest picks up and clicks on the vision. I read it very slow, very slow as I weigh each and every word as it is interjected to the character of person who is writing it. I have first impressions immediately. They seem to be not quite like I was used to reading with EGW. I had to weigh a lot as his vision was quite descriptive. I really had to set back and think about this "new messenger".  Then I had to recall many many years of reading just in case and then I realized how "compelling this was".  Without going into bringing up all scripture and EGW and going through the whole thing I came up with just my own "no important to anyone else theory" for my own thoughts on this.

First of all I realize what the scripture says about the dreams and visions to the people. So my thoughton this is it would happen on personal basis for each individuals ability to be open to the Holy Spirit more and more as time getting close.  I for one can vouch for this happening but it did not mean for me to go out and broadcast my own personal happenings and try to collect a following. Maybe to testify that yes, it does happen. Mine happened when very young and then again in different situation for a different problem later in years. So as I feel I had a true dream with no doubt as the only way my thoughts were known was by the Holy Spirit to answer that thought was like it was done for Neb. No one under the sun could have known my thoughts but God. I cannot even begin to explain it to someone else. Also I do not believe just because I did have this dream that it presents a salvation for sure for me. It is between me and Jesus. I can tell what the dream was but cannot explain the beauty of it. I do know that when I was aroused in the middle of the night that I was breathless and could not get my breath when awake. I was gasping. I hold the look until my time is gone.

So I am in belief this happens but not in the manner that this is coming across. I drew my conclusion even before I ventured into the negative parts of other posts and then to the part where EK lied. So that was sort of a confirming part on "my own conclusions".

Next, I have studied the "Trinity" a lot and have outlined all EGW referring to the workings of each and how each works in their connection of man in his own timing. Again will not go into detail of my own studies but the dream does not fit within the realms of the works of Jesus appearing and his separations to each individual around the table sort of thing. That was off the wall (in my own opinion) and the entrance was too. Think about it. It just seems to me that Jesus will not portray His entry of this sort in so many different ways when he has already discrib ed His coming to this earth. The Grandstanding in the dream of entrance by trumpets and angels gave me not a good feeling immediately and instant dislike. He is not going to personally touch this earth by His presence and angels in this manner now and then take away from the Original Glory and His timing presented for just a few individuals present.   In my dream I was being lifted up into a realm of darkness in total space and the stars underneath and around me and height with out being arrayed in terror of my phobia of heights. I was totally alone in this until.... It made no difference at the time. I was trying to get to Him as hard as I could. I also realize I very well could be totally wrong and just giving my opinion on the EK versions.

 Being a follower to any of this or to anyone is a highly suspicious venture when the credentials of a true "messenger is not available for proof and flawed then on again. I feel safer to be on a one to one basis with the Holy Spirit and stay tuned if and when he chooses to ever let me have another "dream". Could not this be most confusing to wonder which messenger to follow and then so time consuming to compare all their messages and see if they match! Who has the time now for this in this late date? Seems this could be deadly. Again, just my own thoughts and personal experience of study and happenings. But for sure EK has a strong "seance" of "apostasy" in the church and that I also feel is happening but soon all will be unmasked.

[Murcielago]

Ernie Knoll has quite a following, especially when there is messages concering Ed Reid, Angel Rodriguez, Steve Wohlberg, Eugene Prewit, David Gates, Vance Ferrell, Linda Kirk, Laura Lee Jones.

Thanks Spud. I visited the sight. I found it amusing and sad. He seems to attempt to give himself credibility by using EGW, but has a completely self-centered mission that is based entirely around attacking and hurting, drawing people away from the church, and using his herald to badmouth people who question him, as opposed to spreading the good news of Jesus and his healing love. A group that is based on isolation, fear of others, and fear of doing wrong according to the group leader has no foundation in Christianity as practiced and taught by Christ himself.



edited to remove website address - those interested can find it elsewhere.

[Murcielago]

So you think he has quite a following? The following of a false prophet because of "messages" about people is just sad. Someone whose "prophesies" lead people away from Jesus in order to focus them on people needs to rethink what they come up with as "prophecy."

[Murcielago]

Ernie Knoll has had visions that are relative to the end times of this earth.

At least that is what he claims. Yet, he doesn't seem to "have visions" or take actions that fulfill the Gospel commission, they all seem to be based on either lifting him up or tearing down people who question him. You are either with him in his car where he is in the front seat, or you are going into perdition.

[sonshineonme]

Ernie Knoll has had visions that are relative to the end times of this earth.

At least that is what he claims. Yet, he doesn't seem to "have visions" or take actions that fulfill the Gospel commission, they all seem to be based on either lifting him up or tearing down people who question him. You are either with him in his car where he is in the front seat, or you are going into perdition.

ok, I'm editing my post here d/t more findings of confusing info on this situation (to me) and feel I need to re-read a few things before making my post again. Sorry!! 

[HelenJames]

I think this topic was discussed loads of time before at this forum

[Enoch]

Tinka,

Those whose "works will follow them" are not part of the 144,000.  They consist of workers distinct from the 144,000, who will die and be resurrected when Jesus comes.  To explain further, the 144,000 represents a literal number of people.   The number represents only the males over a certain age.  The number does not include women and children.  God changes not- notice that geneologies in the bible by and large include only males....  Although there will be women and children in the post-probation remnant, the 144,000 males are the ones that God counts....Just thought I'd add this.

I hope no one misunderstands me here.  I can clarify further at a later time if need be.

-Laodicea

You are picking and choosing what you find literal versus symbolic as it suits your needs.  Or do you believe that the 144,000 will all be Israelites with 12,000 coming from each tribe?