Advent Talk
Issues & Concerns Category => 3ABN => Topic started by: Bob Pickle on October 27, 2008, 10:01:29 AM
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Since 3ABN has issued a press release, I would suggest that folks might take it and send it to every media outlet and talk show host that you can think of. Larry King, Fox News, that Grace lady, Christianity Today, Wall Street Journal, etc.
National Enquirer would even maybe pay you for the tip.
And if you send their press release on, you can tell these media folks that I am available for interviews, and can send them loads of documents that have not been declared confidential.
To all appearances 3ABN is claiming that there was nothing wrong with Danny's 2003 horse donation and his 1998 real estate deal and his 2006 TCTR campaign. That is a blatant fraud, and every media outlet that gets 3ABN's press release needs to have the opportunity to know just how big a fraud and a farce it is.
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Here is the link to 3ABN's press release: http://www.3abn.org/announcements.cfm
It is titled: Reputation of Three Angels Broadcasting Network Restored, Lawsuit Dropped
Bob, has the court agreed with the demand for dismissal of the lawsuit?
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Since 3ABN has issued a press release, I would suggest that folks might take it and send it to every media outlet and talk show host that you can think of. Larry King, Fox News, that Grace lady, Christianity Today, Wall Street Journal, etc.
National Enquirer would even maybe pay you for the tip.
And if you send their press release on, you can tell these media folks that I am available for interviews, and can send them loads of documents that have not been declared confidential.
Why don't you do your own dirty work?
You know of course the MN conference never owned up to anything,no responsibility of any kind for what happened. Would my son have been jsutified in doing same?
Again, you make me enormously proud of my son. HIs life was destroyed, his children hurt beyond belief. He refused requests for interviews and the national media which did approach him. Not because he asked for someone to contact the media. To do so would have been only because he wanted to inflict as much damage as possible to the denomination
To all appearances 3ABN is claiming that there was nothing wrong with Danny's 2003 horse donation and his 1998 real estate deal and his 2006 TCTR campaign. That is a blatant fraud, and every media outlet that gets 3Ban's press release needs to have the opportunity to know just how big a fraud and a farce it is.
To all apearances the MN conference claimed no wrong doing as well. Should we have done what you are now trying to get others to do
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Here is the whole text of this press release:
PRESS RELEASE
FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE
Reputation of Three Angels Broadcasting Network Restored, Lawsuit Dropped
October 23, 2008 - West Frankfort, Illinois – Dr. Walter Thompson, Chairman of the Board of Directors of Three Angels Broadcasting Network (3ABN), announced today that the Board has instructed its attorneys to seek dismissal of its lawsuit against Robert Pickle and Gailon Arthur Joy, which has been pending in Massachusetts Federal Court since April, 2007.
The Board made the difficult decision to file a lawsuit after first applying biblical principles on conflict resolution. The suit came only after 3ABN tried to persuade Mr. Pickle and Mr. Joy to shut down websites they owned and operated which were being used to spread disparaging statements about 3ABN, and its founder and past president, Danny Shelton.
The Board originally authorized the lawsuit in order to protect 3ABN’s name from being hijacked by those who would use it to attract 3ABN supporters to their website, and then burden them with messages of despair and distrust, instead of hope and faith.
The Board took forceful steps because it felt that protecting the organization’s good name was necessary to the fulfillment of 3ABN’s mission of broadcasting the everlasting gospel to the world as it is described in the three angels’ messages of Revelation 14 and 18.
The lawsuit, entitled, “Three Angels Broadcasting Network, Inc. and Danny Lee Shelton vs. Gailon Arthur Joy and Robert Pickle,” alleges that Mr. Joy and Mr. Pickle violated federal trademark laws by owning and operating web sites that contained the “3ABN” name, which they used to publish false accusations about 3ABN and Mr. Shelton. However, on August 14, 2007, Mr. Joy filed for personal bankruptcy in the Massachusetts bankruptcy courts. The websites that 3ABN alleged were in violation of trademark laws were among Mr. Joy’s assets. On February 12, 2008, 3ABN bought them from the bankruptcy trustee for a nominal sum. The web sites were then immediately shut down, which achieved one of the major goals of the lawsuit.
The Board felt that the other major objective of the lawsuit, that of assuring the public that 3ABN’s financial and administrative conduct was proper, has also been achieved outside of the lawsuit. Although 3ABN and Danny Shelton have always used the services of outside accounting firms to make sure that their tax returns and other filings are accurate and in full compliance with the laws, the Internal Revenue Service conducted a thorough review of 3ABN and Mr. Shelton which included a review of their financial records for the audit period, 2000 to 2006.
The investigation took more than a year, and in July 2008, 3ABN’s attorneys related that the IRS investigation had ended. After reviewing over 100,000 pages of financial records, and interviewing numerous witnesses, the investigation simply ended without requesting 3ABN or Mr. Shelton to change their tax returns in any way, or to pay additional taxes.
The Board views this IRS action as a vindication of its position that both 3ABN and Danny Shelton fully complied with tax laws. Had the IRS found any violations it would have, at the very least, ordered them to file corrected returns. Instead, there was no finding that 3ABN, or Mr. Shelton, had committed any wrongful act.
The Board had hoped for a letter from the IRS indicating that 3ABN and Mr. Shelton were in full compliance with the law, but the attorneys informed us that the IRS does not issue such letters, no matter what their investigation shows.
Similarly, Mr. Pickle and Mr. Joy had made allegations that certain 3ABN employees in the wills and trusts department had been mistreated. These allegations were investigated by California state authorities, as well as the U.S. Equal Employment Opportunity Commission. 3ABN was notified by its attorneys in March 2008 that the claims had been dismissed for insufficient evidence. Once again, the governmental agencies charged with enforcing the law looked into the allegations, and determined there was no evidence that any law had been violated.
Last week, the Board reviewed figures showing that 3ABN’s donation levels have returned to the level they enjoyed before the attack on its reputation began. They believe this shows that the public’s confidence in 3ABN has been restored. When the Board concluded that 3ABN’s reputation was no longer being significantly harmed by the Defendants’ activities, they decided that continuation of the lawsuit could not achieve more than what had already been achieved by other means. The Board then promptly voted to direct its attorneys to dismiss the lawsuit.
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Here is the whole text of this press release:
PRESS RELEASE
FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE
Reputation of Three Angels Broadcasting Network Restored, Lawsuit Dropped
October 23, 2008 - West Frankfort, Illinois – Dr. Walter Thompson, Chairman of the Board of Directors of Three Angels Broadcasting Network (3ABN), announced today that the Board has instructed its attorneys to seek dismissal of its lawsuit against Robert Pickle and Gailon Arthur Joy, which has been pending in Massachusetts Federal Court since April, 2007.
The Board made the difficult decision to file a lawsuit after first applying biblical principles on conflict resolution. The suit came only after 3ABN tried to persuade Mr. Pickle and Mr. Joy to shut down websites they owned and operated which were being used to spread disparaging statements about 3ABN, and its founder and past president, Danny Shelton.
The Board originally authorized the lawsuit in order to protect 3ABN’s name from being hijacked by those who would use it to attract 3ABN supporters to their website, and then burden them with messages of despair and distrust, instead of hope and faith.
The Board took forceful steps because it felt that protecting the organization’s good name was necessary to the fulfillment of 3ABN’s mission of broadcasting the everlasting gospel to the world as it is described in the three angels’ messages of Revelation 14 and 18.
The lawsuit, entitled, “Three Angels Broadcasting Network, Inc. and Danny Lee Shelton vs. Gailon Arthur Joy and Robert Pickle,” alleges that Mr. Joy and Mr. Pickle violated federal trademark laws by owning and operating web sites that contained the “3ABN” name, which they used to publish false accusations about 3ABN and Mr. Shelton. However, on August 14, 2007, Mr. Joy filed for personal bankruptcy in the Massachusetts bankruptcy courts. The websites that 3ABN alleged were in violation of trademark laws were among Mr. Joy’s assets. On February 12, 2008, 3ABN bought them from the bankruptcy trustee for a nominal sum. The web sites were then immediately shut down, which achieved one of the major goals of the lawsuit.
The Board felt that the other major objective of the lawsuit, that of assuring the public that 3ABN’s financial and administrative conduct was proper, has also been achieved outside of the lawsuit. Although 3ABN and Danny Shelton have always used the services of outside accounting firms to make sure that their tax returns and other filings are accurate and in full compliance with the laws, the Internal Revenue Service conducted a thorough review of 3ABN and Mr. Shelton which included a review of their financial records for the audit period, 2000 to 2006.
The investigation took more than a year, and in July 2008, 3ABN’s attorneys related that the IRS investigation had ended. After reviewing over 100,000 pages of financial records, and interviewing numerous witnesses, the investigation simply ended without requesting 3ABN or Mr. Shelton to change their tax returns in any way, or to pay additional taxes.
The Board views this IRS action as a vindication of its position that both 3ABN and Danny Shelton fully complied with tax laws. Had the IRS found any violations it would have, at the very least, ordered them to file corrected returns. Instead, there was no finding that 3ABN, or Mr. Shelton, had committed any wrongful act.
The Board had hoped for a letter from the IRS indicating that 3ABN and Mr. Shelton were in full compliance with the law, but the attorneys informed us that the IRS does not issue such letters, no matter what their investigation shows.
Similarly, Mr. Pickle and Mr. Joy had made allegations that certain 3ABN employees in the wills and trusts department had been mistreated. These allegations were investigated by California state authorities, as well as the U.S. Equal Employment Opportunity Commission. 3ABN was notified by its attorneys in March 2008 that the claims had been dismissed for insufficient evidence. Once again, the governmental agencies charged with enforcing the law looked into the allegations, and determined there was no evidence that any law had been violated.
Last week, the Board reviewed figures showing that 3ABN’s donation levels have returned to the level they enjoyed before the attack on its reputation began. They believe this shows that the public’s confidence in 3ABN has been restored. When the Board concluded that 3ABN’s reputation was no longer being significantly harmed by the Defendants’ activities, they decided that continuation of the lawsuit could not achieve more than what had already been achieved by other means. The Board then promptly voted to direct its attorneys to dismiss the lawsuit.
Hmmm.....nothing about Tommy in there.
Musta just forgot it. Yeah, that's gotta be it.
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Bonnie - Maybe if your son or you had done such the church would have been forced to deal with the problem on a larger level and maybe some other family would have been spared the hurt. They may have been forced to not ship pastors off to some other church rather than dealing with the problems. :dunno:
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Bonnie - Maybe if your son or you had done such the church would have been forced to deal with the problem on a larger level and maybe some other family would have been spared the hurt. They may have been forced to not ship pastors off to some other church rather than dealing with the problems. :dunno:
The responsibility for that lies in the hands of the members. Most members are not concerned enough for each in their own churches to make sure vulnerable people are protected. As members we have allowed the denomination to act in this manner.
It is not the failure somehow of my son that other families are hurt. He fought for six years and for six years it was considered his fault it became news. "He was in it for the easy money", "Yeah, the pastor was wrong,but there were good things he was doing"
What Bob is after from his post is for members here to make calls and make it known enough that it gets picked up and he gets a few more minutes of fame.
To even contemplate the contacting of a sleaze magazine like National Enquirer for pay is something that should give all some long serious thought about the motivation
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Bonnie - Maybe if your son or you had done such the church would have been forced to deal with the problem on a larger level and maybe some other family would have been spared the hurt. They may have been forced to not ship pastors off to some other church rather than dealing with the problems. :dunno:
The responsibility for that lies in the hands of the members. Most members are not concerned enough for each in their own churches to make sure vulnerable people are protected. As members we have allowed the denomination to act in this manner.
Yes, and doing what members like Bob and Gailon are doing in making public that garbage helps to prevent it from continuing. They have shown enough concern for people that they have put themselves at significant risk to try stopping the abuse, yet you can do nothing but attack them for at least trying. Have you tried? Or have you simply sat on the sidelines criticising them and talking about how hopeless it is to try doing anything?
It is not the failure somehow of my son that other families are hurt. He fought for six years and for six years it was considered his fault it became news. "He was in it for the easy money", "Yeah, the pastor was wrong,but there were good things he was doing"
What Bob is after from his post is for members here to make calls and make it known enough that it gets picked up and he gets a few more minutes of fame.
And you know this, how? You seem to have a very big problem with someone actually taking action to help people who have been hurt and trying to stop further hurt. It is not uncommon for people who don't have it in them to do anything when someone is being hurt to attack the people who are doing something. Whatever issue you may have with Bob's call for people to make sure that the press gets 3ABN's press release, he at least has tried to do something. What about you? Other than attacking people who do something, what have you done? What are you doing to stop the various abuses perpetrated on people by 3ABN and some of its administrative people.
To even contemplate the contacting of a sleaze magazine like National Enquirer for pay is something that should give all some long serious thought about the motivation.
To perpetually attack people who try to help people raises serious questions about motivation as well.
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What about putting out our own press release from Bob and Gailon?
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Habanero wrote:
To perpetually attack people who try to help people raises serious questions about motivation as well.
Worth considering!
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color=red]And you know this, how? You seem to have a very big problem with someone actually taking action to help people who have been hurt and trying to stop further hurt. It is not uncommon for people who don't have it in them to do anything when someone is being hurt to attack the people who are doing something. Whatever issue you may have with Bob's call for people to make sure that the press gets 3ABN's press release, he at least has tried to do something. What about you? Other than attacking people who do something, what have you done? What are you doing to stop the various abuses perpetrated on people by 3ABN and some of its administrative people.[/color]
To even contemplate the contacting of a sleaze magazine like National Enquirer for pay is something that should give all some long serious thought about the motivation.
To perpetually attack people who try to help people raises serious questions about motivation as well.
No, I don't have a problem with someone taking action to help people. I have a problem when the actions of the ones helping can't be distinguished from the ones doing the harm.
We have a new member "Crystal" wanting to cause speculation concerning DS and other women. Maybe true,but if she knows she should say so instead of what could be baseless speculation. Now we have this.........
Might ask if he has ever videotaped some high school baseball games and put them up for satellite viewing?
It seems to be a game by where we put out likely scenario's speculation instead of coming straight out with the facts.
Maybe because what people can speculate is much juicer than what occurred.
Fran's reply below is what speculation does. Is it true, say so. If you have no idea or are simply trying to create more suspicion it is wrong.
That is what I object to, not someone trying to help another in need. Calling the National Enquirer for pay. To me that has really stooped lower than the limbo pole
This questions brings to mind many more questions.
If this is true, did Danny use 3ABN equipment and workers?
If so, he should have receipts showing where he rented the equipment; paid for the air time; and paid the workers out of his own pocket, right?
If not, he should be able to explain just exactly how this spread the gospel to the world, right?
If it was donors funds that were used for this event, did the donors agree that this was an activity they would approve of?
If this was done, was this done to Glorify God or to glorify Danny?
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Bob,
So, after about two years of threats, intimidation, harassment, expenses, and incredible hardship caused not only to you and Gailon but to all those who dared to show all the evil things that have been going on at 3ABN, Danny Shelton and Walter Thompson have decided to drop the lawsuit and simply walk away. From the press release it is clear that they don’t want to accept that anything went wrong at 3ABN. The guilty ones are the people who blew the whistle on the wrongs going on there.
How nice! What happens with all the pain they have caused to hundreds of people all this time? Who returns the money spent on this arrogant and evil lawsuit? Who pays for the hundreds of hours spent collecting evidence? Are you and Gailon going to allow Danny Shelton, Walter Thompson, and their gang to get away with it? It would be an extraordinary injustice to permit these evil men to continue their evil actions without any kind of consequences. All our actions have consequences. They need to be brought to accountability! They need to be brought to confess all the evil deeds they have committed and resign from their positions! They need to go to prison!
These people should not get even near 3ABN. They are not God’s people, and do not represent His work. They are mean, arrogant, and unrepentant evil men who do their own thing while they claim that they are doing God’s work.
Are you two going to countersue?
Eduard
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Eduard,
Gailon basically knows who I am as we have communicated off site. I for one can vouch through a very high profile situation and case to go through something when all is piled against you to take what you have by huge high powered political organization for political reasons. We also have all truth of the matter in documents to prove truth. In fact the only thing we have left is truth of what happened. Not one soul to help or care after we were stripped of everything. (Just like Linda). We know exactely how it feels. No brethern to help you, No lawyers that won't unless be paid big bucks, Humulation, no where to go. So the game plan is the same pattern with this horrific truth of facts of visual extravanza of 3abn, that while all the dirt is swept under the carpet to check out the next days incoming cash from the followers of the "piper of distruction." Does anyone on here realize the destruction of lives that can happen from cover up. Our lives have been devestated by exactely this sort of stance of much higher organization of power then 3ABN. The true believer knows that this is not what EGW says to cover up...This is total corruption of true facts. Money and power it takes to "cover up" in order to take in more of the money and all stand on that side help it out. We know it first hand.
I am new on here and not used to be on sites like this so it will take me a little time to see how all this works as I even barely do the computer other then some personal use. Sometimes my words don't come out exactely just right or music to anyone's ears but my heart hopefully is in the right place. I cannot stand to see as I read the destruction of peoples lives that this has caused that have nothing else but greed of moneyand passions. IF there was nothing wrong you would not have this now. and again, "shun all appearances of evil." Is everyone blind to the facts of what has happened to peoples lives?? Do you think that God's has to let his word go through the Spirit Of Darkness to be spread throughout the world? What are we thinking??
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Is everyone blind to the facts of what has happened to peoples lives?? Do you think that God's has to let his word go through the Spirit Of Darkness to be spread throughout the world? What are we thinking??
No to your question. I believe much has been or is wrong at 3ABN. I don't believe that all that have had faith in what DS seemed to represent are trash or without value.
To try to get media attention by a round about way,pretending they have sought him out, which I believe Bob would do.
Suggesting the National Enquirer to those interested in doing this for pay simply cannot be excused.
Don't you think those they have been championing...those little abused people should be putting up the funds instead of asking 3abn donor money to pay them? Or the National Enquirer to pay. Oh wait, maybe those little people aren't cooperating any more.
Tell meif I were to tell you that(speculation of course) that bob or gailon,either one are seperated from their wife. Then wonder if maybe there are a number of women involved. How long would that remain as compared to "the many women " speculation concerning DS. If he did, say so. If he didn't or you don't know,don't speculate maliciously
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Since 3ABN has issued a press release, I would suggest that folks might take it and send it to every media outlet and talk show host that you can think of. Larry King, Fox News, that Grace lady, Christianity Today, Wall Street Journal, etc.
National Enquirer would even maybe pay you for the tip.
And if you send their press release on, you can tell these media folks that I am available for interviews, and can send them loads of documents that have not been declared confidential.
To all appearances 3ABN is claiming that there was nothing wrong with Danny's 2003 horse donation and his 1998 real estate deal and his 2006 TCTR campaign. That is a blatant fraud, and every media outlet that gets 3ABN's press release needs to have the opportunity to know just how big a fraud and a farce it is.
This is just one of many calls by you and others to contact the mainstream press as well as government agencies. We never did hear back how successful your past efforts were when you were dropping what was then considered new and explosive charges. Can you give us an update on the results of your past efforts?
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Bonnie,
I thought I posted back to you but guess it did not work I hope I am not doing this again and the post is somewhere I cannot find. I do not even know if I am in the right spot but thought it was important to reply, I can't find where you were and left out at but I do remember what you said and would like to answer your question of using the funds of "little abused people".
Here is the deal as I see it. Not that it matters except if it is right in the sight of God.
I see it is of no concern the personal lives of Bob, Galion, or even DS. As no one has complete control what happens in their persoal lives. What really is of concern in the 3abn saga is the "misuse and abuse" of the decieved givers of funds to DS and then let his personal life come in play to gain the assests to himself and therefore away from Linda and known victims. Bob and Gallon's personal life had nothing to do with 3abn's misuse of funds. I really do not care how it is stopped whether it be by News media, Bob, Gallon, or some powerful person. I would not have cared how or who if someone would have stood up for us They took our money, land and business all to the tune of greed and political use. Right is right and truth is truth. I want you to remember one thing. No one stood up for Jesus at the trial! But he was right.
Now, this is how I feel about the matter
As far as letting those "little abused people" to put up the funds. I guess I would rather see the funds used to clean up the mess instead of DS using it for extravaganza and personal ego and entertainment. I am not sure about answering your question as I cannot see or find your post and how you stated it. Too many threads to remember I guess.
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I can't find where you were and left out at but I do remember what you said and would like to answer your question of using the funds of "little abused people".
Here is the deal as I see it. Not that it matters except if it is right in the sight of God.
If it is right in the sight of God is the key isn't it
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I see it is of no concern the personal lives of Bob, Galion, or even DS. As no one has complete control what happens in their persoal lives.
Many things we can't control, our personal behaviour is something we can. Our motivation for acting in a certain way.
The personal life of each, that has contributed to the current problem is of concern.
If less than ethical people are attacked, called to account my less than ethical people it is a problem. It never works well for instance to rail against a drunk, if you(general) are a drunk. If you are a tax cheat turning someone in that cheats on his taxes.
What really is of concern in the 3abn saga is the "misuse and abuse" of the decieved givers of funds to DS and then let his personal life come in play to gain the assests to himself and therefore away from Linda and known victims
That is a concern and important but does not excuse what Bob has suggested.
Bob and Gallon's personal life had nothing to do with 3abn's misuse of funds. I really do not care how it is stopped whether it be by News media, Bob, Gallon, or some powerful person.
Then let Bob and Gailon do as they choose without involving others. More often than not in scandals the media is quite good in investigating the accuser to see how they stack up.
Perhaps Bob is ready to place his family in that position.
I would not have cared how or who if someone would have stood up for us They took our money, land and business all to the tune of greed and political use. Right is right and truth is truth. I want you to remember one thing. No one stood up for Jesus at the trial! But he was right.
Now, this is how I feel about the matter
I am well aware of the circumstances surrounding Jesus and no one standing up for him. I also remember there was someone called Judas pretending to be a disciple and friend. Keep that one in mind
As far as letting those "little abused people" to put up the funds. I guess I would rather see the funds used to clean up the mess instead of DS using it for extravaganza and personal ego and entertainment. I am not sure about answering your question as I cannot see or find your post and how you stated it. Too many threads to remember I guess.
What do you think would be cleaned up. If and I don't know that they have,the IRS has completed it's investigation,if those that claim they were fired as whistleblowers,if TS never charged or convicted was given a tribute,what is it you expect to happen.
Some nasty publicity that actually fades rather quickly from the mind of the public.
What doesn't from friends,family,church is what can easily prove the accuser and his life to be as distasteful as what they claim to want to clean up
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tinka,
I don't know what took place in your life,it does not sound pleasent.
Our family had it's own ordeal. Not going into it in detail but how would you think my son's personal life would have been no one's business if he accused the pastor of having an "affair" with my DIL, at the same time my son's behavior was same.
If my son had been an abusive husband how would it have worked to accuse someone else as being an abusive husband
Just to add, If someone is discovered to have a certain behaviour as a pattern of his/her life?
You can bet if the media was even interested they would be taking a close look at the accuser.
edited to add last paragraph
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I can't find where you were and left out at but I do remember what you said and would like to answer your question of using the funds of "little abused people".
Here is the deal as I see it. Not that it matters except if it is right in the sight of God.
If it is right in the sight of God is the key isn't it
Bonnie
Hmm, I think I'm starting to get the hang of posting now.
What do I think should be cleared up at 3abn!! I would like to see new faces in charge or control, that you know you can trust, believe, justice served, better managment, accountability of pew funds, more outside music, feature more local churches in different areas, at least someone that does not pull their own chain, but what can I say. I have not watched it since this started and that has been some time ago. My most favorite part was when Linda sat on the porch and did her short stories. There was just one thing though that did get my attention a little as I have never been in any other religion and I did not understand the strangness of her raising her hand when praying. I am not sure my hands are so clean to hold up to the Lord. I feel like crawing in a hole when I come to him. I want to be so clean in his sight. I was never used to that and still not but she had an honest beautiful talented humble face. But other then all the documents that I have read. I still feel that she was duped. To tell you the truth when I read about the little test she did on DS. I just laughted because if my husband ever accused me of something like that, that very well could have been something I would have done too. Really I related to that. IF he constantly accused me of an affair. I am very afraid I could have done something like that too. But who knows for sure again their personal life. That is what I am saying. IF there is no way to prove anything ONLY GO BY WHAT YOU CAN SEE. DS and LS have personal lives that only God know the truth. But the truth we can see without doubt is great extravaganza, intertainment, (horses, sport cars, planes, rolex, hair, and what makes it tick) Believe me, I am sick, sick over it. This is what I want someone to undue, go after, change, and with who ever, or what ever it takes.
Bonnie, I do not know anyone at all on here. Actually I am reading because I watch what happens to the church and its people, and I do this and the patterns of peoples post on which side they are on I relate well into all the books that EGW wrote. I found they are the best phycology books that one could ever read. I think this helps keep my sanity of what has happened in our lives.
Forgive me as I was not sure of the meaning of your last post other then it appears it seems that someone was with your daughter in law (DiL )while her husband or your son was doing the same. I was not reading it clear what you meant. Really I am on here as green as you can get but very very familar with every article that has been presented in documents. Any jury that took the time to read all would as I see it would put DS in the hot seat. And believe me I am a person that has to have no doubt. For anything any different I need to see the proof. I do know some people that worked at 3abn and that used to be pretty close but at this time I would not want to expand on who they are but sure wished I knew if they were still there. Oh well. You know Bonnie, somethime it takes some one special, rough, tough, educated, ruthless, talent to put together unseen hidden, evil deeds out in the open. I consider that smart as a serpent. If only my husband I and would have had those traits maybe we could have seen the evil coming our way. It was so unexpected. unexplainable and felt at the time the Lord entirely disowned us and in our hearts were faithful all the years. Now our children, I just can't go on...... I sort of take personal what happens to God's church that It took me seven years to read about. I believe it. I see it.
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I see it is of no concern the personal lives of Bob, Galion, or even DS. As no one has complete control what happens in their persoal lives.
Many things we can't control, our personal behaviour is something we can. Our motivation for acting in a certain way.
The personal life of each, that has contributed to the current problem is of concern.
If less than ethical people are attacked, called to account my less than ethical people it is a problem. It never works well for instance to rail against a drunk, if you(general) are a drunk. If you are a tax cheat turning someone in that cheats on his taxes.
What really is of concern in the 3abn saga is the "misuse and abuse" of the decieved givers of funds to DS and then let his personal life come in play to gain the assests to himself and therefore away from Linda and known victims
That is a concern and important but does not excuse what Bob has suggested.
Bob and Gallon's personal life had nothing to do with 3abn's misuse of funds. I really do not care how it is stopped whether it be by News media, Bob, Gallon, or some powerful person.
Then let Bob and Gailon do as they choose without involving others. More often than not in scandals the media is quite good in investigating the accuser to see how they stack up.
Perhaps Bob is ready to place his family in that position.
I would not have cared how or who if someone would have stood up for us They took our money, land and business all to the tune of greed and political use. Right is right and truth is truth. I want you to remember one thing. No one stood up for Jesus at the trial! But he was right.
Now, this is how I feel about the matter
I am well aware of the circumstances surrounding Jesus and no one standing up for him. I also remember there was someone called Judas pretending to be a disciple and friend. Keep that one in mind
As far as letting those "little abused people" to put up the funds. I guess I would rather see the funds used to clean up the mess instead of DS using it for extravaganza and personal ego and entertainment. I am not sure about answering your question as I cannot see or find your post and how you stated it. Too many threads to remember I guess.
What do you think would be cleaned up. If and I don't know that they have,the IRS has completed it's investigation,if those that claim they were fired as whistleblowers,if TS never charged or convicted was given a tribute,what is it you expect to happen.
Some nasty publicity that actually fades rather quickly from the mind of the public.
What doesn't from friends,family,church is what can easily prove the accuser and his life to be as distasteful as what they claim to want to clean up
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Hmm, I think I'm starting to get the hang of posting now.
What do I think should be cleared up at 3abn!! I would like to see new faces in charge or control, that you know you can trust, believe, justice served, better managment, accountability of pew funds, more outside music, feature more local churches in different areas, at least someone that does not pull their own chain, but what can I say. I have not watched it since this started and that has been some time ago. My most favorite part was when Linda sat on the porch and did her short stories
3ABN is not the church. It is an independent ministry. We cannot demand new faces in charge,we cannot force better management. Accusing someone that is guilty may force a change for a time,but unless they change it isn't going to happen. Accountibility of funds should be a given but usually is not. We don't have full accountibility from the SDA official org.
I still feel that she was duped. To tell you the truth when I read about the little test she did on DS. I just laughted because if my husband ever accused me of something like that, that very well could have been something I would have done too. Really I related to that. IF he constantly accused me of an affair. I am very afraid I could have done something like that too.
Maybe she was. So how does that become the business at this time of the internet world. If there is a legal recourse she is the one that has to take it. If she does not it is a dead issue.
To plant a pregnancy test for an already accusing husband is the height of foolishness.
IF there is no way to prove anything ONLY GO BY WHAT YOU CAN SEE. DS and LS have personal lives that only God know the truth. But the truth we can see without doubt is great extravaganza, intertainment, (horses, sport cars, planes, rolex, hair, and what makes it tick) Believe me, I am sick, sick over it. This is what I want someone to undue, go after, change, and with who ever, or what ever it takes.
No one can undo what has been done. If Bob and Gailon wish to [pursue if they can go for it,but do it upfront and honestly. Stop with the innuendos and implications. If you know something to have actually happened that is important, quit playing with it and say so
Forgive me as I was not sure of the meaning of your last post other then it appears it seems that someone was with your daughter in law (DiL )while her husband or your son was doing the same. I was not reading it clear what you meant.
It was clergy sexual abuse of my DIL and lead to the breakup of their marriage. His behaviour was known to many for 30 years. No I did not say my son was doing same. I did say if he was guilty of same he would have looked pretty silly accusing and condemning the pastor
Really I am on here as green as you can get but very very familar with every article that has been presented in documents. Any jury that took the time to read all would as I see it would put DS in the hot seat. And believe me I am a person that has to have no doubt. For anything any different I need to see the proof. I do know some people that worked at 3abn and that used to be pretty close but at this time I would not want to expand on who they are but sure wished I knew if they were still there. Oh well
Then the answer is quite simple for Bob and Gailon,get it in front of a jury. Stop the implications. The pretense ,the asking others to do the dirty work of going to the sleezy media such as National Enquirer
. You know Bonnie, somethime it takes some one special, rough, tough, educated, ruthless, talent to put together unseen hidden, evil deeds out in the open. I consider that smart as a serpent. If only my husband I and would have had those traits maybe we could have seen the evil coming our way. It was so unexpected. unexplainable and felt at the time the Lord entirely disowned us and in our hearts were faithful all the years. Now our children, I just can't go on...... I sort of take personal what happens to God's church that It took me seven years to read about. I believe it. I see it.
This is not God's church. It is an independent ministry,not under the control of the SDA. Usually you do have to be tough enough,but ruthless is not a word I would use. The end does not justify the means. Fight it without childish pretense as in the "Explosive New Charges" silliness. Stop playing gotcha with any that can be found connected to 3ABN,not following the sabbath according to Bob's dictates.
If your (general) own reputation cannot withstand medis scrutiny,don't ask anyone else to do it for you..
You seem to have Bob's litany of complaints down remarkably well
edited to correct formatting.
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Hmm, I think I'm starting to get the hang of posting now.
What do I think should be cleared up at 3abn!! I would like to see new faces in charge or control, that you know you can trust, believe, justice served, better managment, accountability of pew funds, more outside music, feature more local churches in different areas, at least someone that does not pull their own chain, but what can I say. I have not watched it since this started and that has been some time ago. My most favorite part was when Linda sat on the porch and did her short stories
3ABN is not the church. It is an independent ministry. We cannot demand new faces in charge,we cannot force better management. Accusing someone that is guilty may force a change for a time,but unless they change it isn't going to happen. Accountibility of funds should be a given but usually is not. We don't have full accountibility from the SDA official org.
Bonnie, I agree for sure, no doubt about it. It's the church they sucked in....
I still feel that she was duped. To tell you the truth when I read about the little test she did on DS. I just laughted because if my husband ever accused me of something like that, that very well could have been something I would have done too. Really I related to that. IF he constantly accused me of an affair. I am very afraid I could have done something like that too.
Maybe she was. So how does that become the business at this time of the internet world. If there is a legal recourse she is the one that has to take it. If she does not it is a dead issue.
To plant a pregnancy test for an already accusing husband is the height of foolishness.
Sometimes husbands have to be taught a foolish lesson. That is of course if you know they really love you. My husband and I have a great understanding of things. (smile)
IF there is no way to prove anything ONLY GO BY WHAT YOU CAN SEE. DS and LS have personal lives that only God know the truth. But the truth we can see without doubt is great extravaganza, intertainment, (horses, sport cars, planes, rolex, hair, and what makes it tick) Believe me, I am sick, sick over it. This is what I want someone to undue, go after, change, and with who ever, or what ever it takes.
No one can undo what has been done. If Bob and Gailon wish to [pursue if they can go for it,but do it upfront and honestly. Stop with the innuendos and implications. If you know something to have actually happened that is important, quit playing with it and say so
Forgive me as I was not sure of the meaning of your last post other then it appears it seems that someone was with your daughter in law (DiL )while her husband or your son was doing the same. I was not reading it clear what you meant.
It was clergy sexual abuse of my DIL and lead to the breakup of their marriage. His behaviour was known to many for 30 years. No I did not say my son was doing same. I did say if he was guilty of same he would have looked pretty silly accusing and condemning the pastor
Believe me I know this can happen with an SDA pastor as well as any. I had one come on to me in early years and was so nieve that I hardly knew where he was coming from until his arm slid around me and started pulling me to sit on his lap. I was shocked and horrified. I could not believe it. Yes I was sad at the time (18 yrs ol) It was embarassing to get rid of him. I was so horrified that I kept it to myself and suffered that a married man tried to touch me. It kept me from church for a while as this one came in as an evangeligist. I often wondered what happened and what he did next. I only finally spoke of it to my husband just a couple of years ago. Wouldn't that be terrible if this was the same clergy!
Really I am on here as green as you can get but very very familar with every article that has been presented in documents. Any jury that took the time to read all would as I see it would put DS in the hot seat. And believe me I am a person that has to have no doubt. For anything any different I need to see the proof. I do know some people that worked at 3abn and that used to be pretty close but at this time I would not want to expand on who they are but sure wished I knew if they were still there. Oh well
Then the answer is quite simple for Bob and Gailon,get it in front of a jury. Stop the implications. The pretense ,the asking others to do the dirty work of going to the sleezy media such as National Enquirer
. You know Bonnie, somethime it takes some one special, rough, tough, educated, ruthless, talent to put together unseen hidden, evil deeds out in the open. I consider that smart as a serpent. If only my husband I and would have had those traits maybe we could have seen the evil coming our way. It was so unexpected. unexplainable and felt at the time the Lord entirely disowned us and in our hearts were faithful all the years. Now our children, I just can't go on...... I sort of take personal what happens to God's church that It took me seven years to read about. I believe it. I see it.
This is not God's church. It is an independent ministry,not under the control of the SDA. Usually you do have to be tough enough,but ruthless is not a word I would use. The end does not justify the means. Fight it without childish pretense as in the "Explosive New Charges" silliness. Stop playing gotcha with any that can be found connected to 3ABN,not following the sabbath according to Bob's dictates.
Again Bonnie, That is what makes DS the Pied piper to misuse, abuse, and use the Adventists to benefit his desires and they all followed like the pigs over the cliff while he is yelling INdependent, Independent. He used The Advent message, There 3 Angels symbols. That makes him so much worse. That is a big deciever, and a thief in my book.
If your (general) own reputation cannot withstand medis scrutiny,don't ask anyone else to do it for you..
You seem to have Bob's litany of complaints down remarkably well,
I came to my own conclusion by the visual facts as I was a great believer in the cause of 3abn. I do not know anyone one here or their background. I am sorry though about DIL and your son. My shock of this sort of thing was just getting away quick. But again look at the worse secenaro of the victims of TS.
edited to correct formatting.
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Bonnie, I agree for sure, no doubt about it. It's the church they sucked in....
But tell me what you are going to do about it? Report them to the GC. Frankly I would suspect we have them here reading as it goes.
The IRS,if that has been concluded not a thing anyone can do. If not and the IRS is still investigating something may come of it. But that is out of the hands of most one here.
You need a concrete complaint before the IRS gets into a lentghy and expensive investigation
Sometimes husbands have to be taught a foolish lesson. That is of course if you know they really love you. My husband and I have a great understanding of things. (smile)
If this woman needed to teach a already accusing husband her husband and her did not have a great understanding of things.
[quote) Believe me, I am sick, sick over it. This is what I want someone to undue, go after, change, and with who ever, or what ever it takes.[/quote]
"The whatever it takes" is the problem. The accuser becomes as bad as the accused
No one can undo what has been done. If Bob and Gailon wish to [pursue if they can go for it,but do it upfront and honestly. Stop with the innuendos and implications. If you know something to have actually happened that is important, quit playing with it and say so
Forgive me as I was not sure of the meaning of your last post other then it appears it seems that someone was with your daughter in law (DiL )while her husband or your son was doing the same. I was not reading it clear what you meant.
Believe me I know this can happen with an SDA pastor as well as any. I had one come on to me in early years and was so naive that I hardly knew where he was coming from until his arm slid around me and started pulling me to sit on his lap. I was shocked and horrified. I could not believe it. Yes I was sad at the time (18 yrs ol) It was embarrassing to get rid of him. I was so horrified that I kept it to myself and suffered that a married man tried to touch me. It kept me from church for a while as this one came in as an Evangelist. I often wondered what happened and what he did next. I only finally spoke of it to my husband just a couple of years ago. Wouldn't that be terrible if this was the same clergy!
Be careful of that,Bob will want to know the exact day you do and the exact day leadership knew. Or a statement made that we have had this going on in the denomination since EW can have Bob wanting to know the dates she knew
Then the answer is quite simple for Bob and Gailon,get it in front of a jury. Stop the implications. The pretense ,the asking others to do the dirty work of going to the sleazy media such as National Enquirer
Again Bonnie, That is what makes DS the Pied piper to misuse, abuse, and use the Adventists to benefit his desires and they all followed like the pigs over the cliff while he is yelling INdependent, Independent. He used The Advent message, There 3 Angels symbols. That makes him so much worse. That is a big deceiver, and a thief in my book.
Two sides follow like pigs,just a toss up to who hits bottom first.
The advent message in the wrong hands does a great deal of damage.
I came to my own conclusion by the visual facts as I was a great believer in the cause of 3abn. I do not know anyone one here or their background. I am sorry though about DIL and your son. My shock of this sort of thing was just getting away quick. But again look at the worse scenario of the victims of TS.
I don't have to look now,I know what happens to many victims. The fact of the matter is no one can do anything to TS. He is not a criminal on the loose,he has not been charged and convicted and DS did nothing illegal about hiring him. I believe people like that belong in prison for a very long time,but ain't going to happen in this. Bob and Gailon cannot fight as a stand in for the alleged victims.
Using sneaky,silly underhanded tactics of Bob and Gailon is not going to make it all right and go away
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3ABN issued a press release. Thus they apparently want it circulated to every media outlet possible.
Anyone sent it on? If so, report back here, if you can, who you sent it to. CNN, ABC, NBC, Fox, Larry King, Rush Limbaugh, National Enquirer, whoever.
And I am available for interviews, since responsible media wouldn't want to simply take 3ABN's word for it that the information in 3ABN's press release is true.
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The going ons at 3ABN is hardly newsworthy in Adventism or the Adventist press....0 newsworthy to the religious press and mainstream media.
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Calvin,
Signs of the Times--Who does care about theft on a Corporate basis. Surley not you.
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I disagree.
The going ons at 3ABN is hardly newsworthy in Adventism or the Adventist press....0 newsworthy to the religious press and mainstream media.
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Daryl Fawcett, Daryl, could you contact me at my email, skiguyfun@aol.com, thanks. Something want to share with you
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Just sent you an email, as I am unable to receive PMs here since leaving admin.
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Daryl, is there any chance your mailbox might be full?
Just sent you an email, as I am unable to receive PMs here since leaving admin.
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It's only full on account of the fact I am no longer on staff, as being on staff didn't have any limitations, which I already knew by the way.
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OK, good. So we know that it is not a forum or a software problem. Once you have a chance to empty your mailbox you'll be able to send and receive PMs just fine!! :wave:
It's only full on account of the fact I am no longer on staff, as being on staff didn't have any limitations, which I already knew by the way.