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Author Topic: Why, oh Why.....  (Read 34893 times)

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princessdi

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Re: Why, oh Why.....
« Reply #30 on: December 07, 2010, 10:31:39 PM »

Come on now Guys, let's think about this logically.  What prrof, besides "the Bible tells me so" do you have that anyone was annoted or appointed"?  Only that you believe the Bible is thw Wrod of God, and God cannot lie.  It is definitely not because of any of those peoples actions.  Only that God's plan was carried out in each situation, sometimes inspite of the ones chosen to act for God.......thnk Jonah.  What would he have had God do to the Niehvites?   It is all in hindsight.  Why will you not believe that God is the same God of the Bible.  Anything Linda and Danny have done is not new and definitely not knew to God,  he has been annointing and appointing flawed man to His Wil and His workl, long before those two came along. God does not only annont or appoint perfect people.  David was appointed and annointed IN SPITE OF his failings, and God knew them when David was out in the field tending sheep.  Well, that is onky if you believe that God is all knowing.  he did not appoint, neither annot David hoping he would do right.   Remember, he died for us while we were yet in our sins.
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It is the duty of every cultured man or woman to read sympathetically the scriptures of the world.  If we are to respect others' religions as we would have them respect our own, a friendly study of the world's religions is a sacred duty. - Mohandas K. Gandhi

childoftheking

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Re: Why, oh Why.....
« Reply #31 on: December 08, 2010, 05:04:42 AM »

I wonder if appointed isn't the correct word rather than but not in addition to the word anointed. In the Bible people were anointed with oil. Oil is a recognized symbol of the Holy Spirit. Just as baptism is a symbol of death, burial and resurrection, being anointed with oil was symbolic of the outpouring of the Holy Spirit upon one to fit them to accomplish the work they were appointed to. Jesus was the anointed one since the Holy Spirit was poured out without measure upon Him so that He was depending upon His Father as we must depend on Him. He was our example.

And since we are only human and look on the outward appearance while God looks on the heart, only God and Danny and Linda can testify to the spiritual condition of their hearts at the time that 3ABN was founded and whether the Holy Spirit was poured out on them to fit them for the task they undertook.  As Peter in the Bible did not know his own heart when Christ told him he would betray Him, they may not even know their own hearts. We understand that even our best efforts are tainted with our own carnality and we do not know whether Danny's "calling" was as he claimed it to be or whether there was in large part a desire to be a musician, singer and performer and to uplift self. We do not know whether the motive and the call he claimed was a rationalization or not. We just cannot know. As Princess has said, the Lord uses odd tools. Some of these tools ultimately fail Him and fall short of their potential. We also know that the test of whether one has the Holy Spirit is not whether one has rapturous feelings but whether one has the fruits of the Spirit. On the other hand we know that the gifts of the Spirit can be counterfeited.
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childoftheking

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Re: Why, oh Why.....
« Reply #32 on: December 08, 2010, 07:46:32 AM »

While Jesus was preparing the disciples for their ordination, one who had not been summoned urged his presence among them. It was Judas Iscariot, a man who professed to be a follower of Christ. . . . Judas believed Jesus to be the Messiah; and by joining the apostles, he hoped to secure a high position in the new kingdom. . . . {CC 285.2}
The disciples were anxious that Judas should become one of their number. He was of commanding appearance, a man of keen discernment and executive ability, and they commended him to Jesus as one who would greatly assist Him in His work. . . . The after history of Judas would show them the danger of allowing any worldly consideration to have weight in deciding the fitness of men for the work of God. . . . {CC 285.3}

Yet when Judas joined the disciples, he was not insensible to the beauty of the character of Christ. He felt the influence of that divine power which was drawing souls to the Saviour. . . . The Saviour read the heart of Judas; He knew the depths of iniquity to which, unless delivered by the grace of God, Judas would sink. In connecting this man with Himself, He placed him where he might, day by day, be brought in contact with the outflowing of His own unselfish love. If he would open his heart to Christ, divine grace would banish the demon of selfishness, and even Judas might become a subject of the kingdom of God. {CC 285.4}

God takes men as they are . . . and trains them for His service, if they will be disciplined and learn of Him. They are not chosen because they are perfect, but notwithstanding their imperfections, that through the knowledge and practice of the truth, through the grace of Christ, they may become transformed into His image. {CC 285.5

Judas saw the sick, the lame, the blind, flock to Jesus from the towns and cities. He saw the dying laid at His feet. He witnessed the Saviour's mighty works in healing the sick, casting out devils, and raising the dead. He felt in his own person the evidence of Christ's power. He recognized the teaching of Christ as superior to all that he had ever heard. He loved the Great Teacher, and desired to be with Him. He felt a desire to be changed in character and life, and he hoped to experience this through connecting himself with Jesus. The Saviour did not repulse Judas. He gave him a place among the twelve. He trusted him to do the work of an evangelist. He endowed him with power to heal the sick and to cast out devils. But Judas did not come to the point of surrendering himself fully to Christ. He did not give up his worldly ambition or his love of money. While he accepted the position of a minister of Christ, he did not bring himself under the divine molding. He felt that he could retain his own judgment and opinions, and he cultivated a disposition to criticize and accuse. {DA 716.4}

In his own estimation he was an honor to the cause, and as such he always represented himself. {DA 717.1}
Judas was blinded to his own weakness of character, and Christ placed him where he would have an opportunity to see and correct this. As treasurer for the disciples, he was called upon to provide for the needs of the little company, and to relieve the necessities of the poor. When in the Passover chamber Jesus said to him, "That thou doest, do quickly" (John 13:27), the disciples thought He had bidden him
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buy what was needed for the feast, or give something to the poor. In ministering to others, Judas might have developed an unselfish spirit. But while listening daily to the lessons of Christ and witnessing His unselfish life, Judas indulged his covetous disposition. The small sums that came into his hands were a continual temptation. Often when he did a little service for Christ, or devoted time to religious purposes, he paid himself out of this meager fund. In his own eyes these pretexts served to excuse his action; but in God's sight he was a thief. {DA 717.2}
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mrst53

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Re: Why, oh Why.....
« Reply #33 on: December 08, 2010, 08:58:08 AM »

I think in some cases, the televangelists start out with a true fire for Jesus Christ, but when riches and power come their way, the Devil begins to tell them, it's not God that is doing this, but themselves. They forget that it is Jesus Christ that gave them the place they have. Altimately, it is Jesus Christ that takes it away from them and brings them down. Hopefully it brings them to their knees. In some cases it doesn't. So far, it doesn't seem to have brought Danny down far enough, but He will.
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Murcielago

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Re: Why, oh Why.....
« Reply #34 on: December 08, 2010, 10:36:05 AM »

To the followers of David Koresh and Jim Jones, those two men were annointed of God. Why? Because they said the things their followers wanted to hear, the things that they would expect God to say. Were they annointed? Did they do any good? Sure they did! Jones worked tirelessly to feed, cloth and house the needy, and brought them into church. Yes, he abused them, and ended up killing them, but he "brought them to the Lord" before he killed them. Charlemaigne converted tens of thousands of pagans to Christianity in a matter of days. Yes, the 40,000 who didn't convert were immediately beheaded, but he did bring the others to the Lord. Of course, it was just a means of expanding his empire, but the Germanic lands were Christianized at the tip of his sword. Was he annointed of God to do what he did? Is the sacrifice of human lives and souls an acceptable part of what God anoints and appoints? I hope not. That would make him not much different than Baal. You can protest that we are not talking about someone who has murdered, but sacrifice of people doesn't always include murder.
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princessdi

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Re: Why, oh Why.....
« Reply #35 on: December 08, 2010, 01:59:30 PM »

OK, ok, I can go with all of this and then add, that is why we are encouraged to study for ourselves, and most importantly to have a personal relationship with God.  We need to do this in order to determine which is the voice of God, his annoited, His appointed.  We as Adventist talk about truth being mixed with error.  We also know that sometimes it is mostly truth and that error is soo very subtle, only a reliance on a personal relationship with Christ will make the difference.  I beleive this is the lesson we all should learn from these types of situations.
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It is the duty of every cultured man or woman to read sympathetically the scriptures of the world.  If we are to respect others' religions as we would have them respect our own, a friendly study of the world's religions is a sacred duty. - Mohandas K. Gandhi

christian

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Re: Why, oh Why.....
« Reply #36 on: December 09, 2010, 09:29:12 PM »

The loud cry the end of days the close of probation all of these miraculous events in there entirety as of yet (in my observation) have not happen. So for me I am expecting God to work in a way that we currently do not understand in simple means that we have previously IGNORED OR HAVE no knowledge of. Whereas I do see the doors opening up all over the world for the proclamation of the gospel to the extent of making Adventism revelant world wide that has not happen Except in the mind of a few who limit the scope of Gods power (AND THIS GOSPEL SHALL BE PREACHED UNTO ALLTHE WORLD AND THEN SHALL THE END COME. Adventism is a very small and unknown group by worldly standards. And the type of Adventism being preached now, by in large, is not at all what Ellen G. White and others envisioned it to be (from our medical institutions) to the health message etc...






OK, ok, I can go with all of this and then add, that is why we are encouraged to study for ourselves, and most importantly to have a personal relationship with God.  We need to do this in order to determine which is the voice of God, his annoited, His appointed.  We as Adventist talk about truth being mixed with error.  We also know that sometimes it is mostly truth and that error is soo very subtle, only a reliance on a personal relationship with Christ will make the difference.  I beleive this is the lesson we all should learn from these types of situations.

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Gailon Arthur Joy

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Re: Why, oh Why.....
« Reply #37 on: December 11, 2010, 07:49:21 PM »

Here, Here...amd what must we do to bring in revival and reformation?

Gailon Arthur Joy
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princessdi

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Re: Why, oh Why.....
« Reply #38 on: December 11, 2010, 09:53:23 PM »

Now here we agree.....so far.....I dont' quite know in which areas you have issues, but I do k now that we, like the COI went left(or right....off the path anywho) at somepoint and now we have waundered from from home...


The loud cry the end of days the close of probation all of these miraculous events in there entirety as of yet (in my observation) have not happen. So for me I am expecting God to work in a way that we currently do not understand in simple means that we have previously IGNORED OR HAVE no knowledge of. Whereas I do see the doors opening up all over the world for the proclamation of the gospel to the extent of making Adventism revelant world wide that has not happen Except in the mind of a few who limit the scope of Gods power (AND THIS GOSPEL SHALL BE PREACHED UNTO ALLTHE WORLD AND THEN SHALL THE END COME. Adventism is a very small and unknown group by worldly standards. And the type of Adventism being preached now, by in large, is not at all what Ellen G. White and others envisioned it to be (from our medical institutions) to the health message etc...






OK, ok, I can go with all of this and then add, that is why we are encouraged to study for ourselves, and most importantly to have a personal relationship with God.  We need to do this in order to determine which is the voice of God, his annoited, His appointed.  We as Adventist talk about truth being mixed with error.  We also know that sometimes it is mostly truth and that error is soo very subtle, only a reliance on a personal relationship with Christ will make the difference.  I beleive this is the lesson we all should learn from these types of situations.


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It is the duty of every cultured man or woman to read sympathetically the scriptures of the world.  If we are to respect others' religions as we would have them respect our own, a friendly study of the world's religions is a sacred duty. - Mohandas K. Gandhi

Gailon Arthur Joy

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Re: Why, oh Why.....
« Reply #39 on: December 12, 2010, 04:52:59 AM »

Yet another Sign of the times...ahain, I await the false revival and then the battle will be joined as never before seen...but, we must also face a time of trouble such as has never before seen and the only way to prepare is to rely soley upon our
relationship with Father, Son and Holy Spirit.

Gailon Arthur Joy
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Johann

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Re: Why, oh Why.....
« Reply #40 on: January 11, 2011, 10:29:38 AM »

Here, Here...amd what must we do to bring in revival and reformation?

Gailon Arthur Joy
AUReporter

Will it be spiritual? Doctrinal? Physical? Relationship? Church? Family?
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princessdi

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Re: Why, oh Why.....
« Reply #41 on: January 11, 2011, 01:52:08 PM »

Ok, so reading back over this thread, I still agree and disagree in the areas stated in my posts above. 

However, as I think about this.  We could argue this for as long as we like, but the bottom line is that David was annoited and appointed and went just about as wrong as you can go.  It makes no difference if it was King or priest, David had an responsibility to walk in that annointing.  He failed to do so on many occasions.  I don't know of any who are claimed or claim themselves annointed and appointed to have gone so far off from that calling.  So the fact that they go down the wrong path is no indiciation that there were not called, appointed, or even annointed.  I am with mrst, I believe most start out believing in their calling and then their frailties get the best of them.
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It is the duty of every cultured man or woman to read sympathetically the scriptures of the world.  If we are to respect others' religions as we would have them respect our own, a friendly study of the world's religions is a sacred duty. - Mohandas K. Gandhi

christian

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Re: Why, oh Why.....
« Reply #42 on: January 12, 2011, 01:46:07 AM »



So true, we agree, DAVID was anointed. However, I fail to see where him being anointed has anything to do with whether Danny was anointed or appointed by God? I still don't understand why you believe Danny was anointed or appointed except from the lips of Danny and his friends. And since he is and independent ministry and non denominational who anointed Him? We know from the Bible that the prophet anointed Samuel anointed David but who anointed Danny? We know that Ellen G. White had to meet the criteria of a prophet as set by the Bible in order for us to except her as sent and anointed. So please tell me where you get any of the evidence that Danny was anointed. Unless you are using the fact that David's name starts with a D and so does Danny. (smile)








Ok, so reading back over this thread, I still agree and disagree in the areas stated in my posts above. 

However, as I think about this.  We could argue this for as long as we like, but the bottom line is that David was annoited and appointed and went just about as wrong as you can go.  It makes no difference if it was King or priest, David had an responsibility to walk in that annointing.  He failed to do so on many occasions.  I don't know of any who are claimed or claim themselves annointed and appointed to have gone so far off from that calling.  So the fact that they go down the wrong path is no indiciation that there were not called, appointed, or even annointed.  I am with mrst, I believe most start out believing in their calling and then their frailties get the best of them.

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HaroldT

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Re: Why, oh Why.....
« Reply #43 on: January 12, 2011, 06:50:51 AM »

Princesdi, please don't even try to compare King David with Danny Shelton.  King David had his sin pointed out to him and he spent a week on his face in repentence. He admitted that he was wrong.
Harold.
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Artiste

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Re: Why, oh Why.....
« Reply #44 on: January 12, 2011, 09:26:13 AM »

Thank you, Harold.
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