Advent Talk
Issues & Concerns Category => 3ABN => Topic started by: childoftheking on February 10, 2008, 09:41:55 AM
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I have been amazed at some of the lies that have been told to DS's supporters in order to explain away documented facts that have been discovered and posted on the internet. At first I asked myself "why would these lies be told by one who knows the facts will prove them to be false.
Then I realized that 1. If a lie works now, the story teller will not worry about the consequences untill and if the lie is found out. 2. Lies have been successfully covered up in the past and perhaps the truth can be legally locked away from the public. 3. If a lie is discovered, another story can always be invented to explain it away.
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I have been amazed at some of the lies that have been told to DS's supporters in order to explain away documented facts that have been discovered and posted on the internet. At first I asked myself "why would these lies be told by one who knows the facts will prove them to be false.
Then I realized that 1. If a lie works now, the story teller will not worry about the consequences untill and if the lie is found out. 2. Lies have been successfully covered up in the past and perhaps the truth can be legally locked away from the public. 3. If a lie is discovered, another story can always be invented to explain it away.
Some people can tend to believe their own lies, over a period of time. Trouble is, problems creep in when one is caught in a lie and then others are created to cover the previous lies. Such a vicious circle. Once on the merry-go-round, it's very difficult to get off.
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Unfortunately these supporters have their own reasons for believing the lies and they parrot them in the forums as if they are truth.
But I feel sorry for them. At some point they have to realize they have been duped.
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How is it, or why is it that any true Christian can be duped?
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Unfortunately these supporters have their own reasons for believing the lies and they parrot them in the forums as if they are truth.
But I feel sorry for them. At some point they have to realize they have been duped.
My real concern is that when people do find out that they have been duped, many will become discouraged and leave the Church. These people need to be covered with prayer also, as they are genuine in their beliefs, even though they are misguided.
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When it is the position of a messianic leader that "if you tell a lie long enough, everyone will believe it"...it permiates the entire organization. The disciples actually do believe and reject the truth, even when it is grossly obvious that it is a lie!!!
And therein is the real problem...how do you undo years of factually challenged propoganda? Unfortunately, history tells us you must engage in direct conflict and spend even more years documenting and printing the TRUTH.
I sat at dinner just last night and a lady told me that she had heard that ALL the staff was happy to get rid of Linda. Yet the current President and the Chairman repeatedly assert that Linda was beloved and is missed. Linda is called frequently by past and current employees bemoaning her being gone.
This lady went on to state that Linda and the Dr had met in Florida over the Easter week in March of 2004 and that Linda had also met the DR in Los Vegas secretly as well, all before the divorce in June 2004. She went on to tell me the about the "hundreds of hours" on the phone and how Linda chased Arild all over europe, including the Greek olympics. We now know that those are false and slanderously defamatory statements.
I asked her the source of these statements and it was Danny Lee Shelton...what a shock, aye??? All made in the fall of 2004, post settlement and divorce with Linda Shelton.
It is interesting watching AT and Ian persistently claim that Save3ABN is all lies and does not prove a thing, yet we have 3ABN and DLS asserting that the websight has convinced people to the point of having many discontinue financially supporting 3ABN.
How do they explain this rather malignant phenomenon? And where is their evidence????
Why is there not a 3ABNexonerated.com or DLSexonerated.com with all the evidence clearly and conspiciously documented and explained????
And therein is the summary of the conflict. Someone is lying and someone is telling the truth...we report, you decide!!! They file suite!!! Is it possible they mis-translated the text and thought it said "The Lawsuite will set you free!!!" Or did they just ignore the TRUTH???
Gailon Arthur Joy
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How is it, or why is it that any true Christian can be duped?
Daryl, I see so many people who do not study for themselves, but rather believe whatever is presented to them. Many people just accept that 'leaders' are 'right'. Some appear to have an 'inferiority complex' and think that they cannot possible 'know' as much as these so-called educated or 'inspired' leaders. Some people do in fact feel intimidated in the presence of some of these people, and feel that they lack the ability to 'know' as much as these great ones!
Some of our leaders have become experts in encouraging people to believe just whatever they say. People need to be reminded that this in NOT the Catholic Church and the 'leaders' are not always right and people do need to question what they are told and study to show themselves approved of God.
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I sat at dinner just last night and a lady told me that . . .
This lady went on to state that Linda and the Dr had met in Florida over the Easter week in March of 2004 and that Linda had also met the DR in Los Vegas secretly as well, all before the divorce in June 2004. She went on to tell me the about the "hundreds of hours" on the phone and how Linda chased Arild all over Europe, including the Greek Olympics. We now know that those are false and slanderously defamatory statements.
I asked her the source of these statements and it was Danny Lee Shelton...what a shock, aye??? All made in the fall of 2004, post settlement and divorce with Linda Shelton.
... Someone is lying and someone is telling the truth...we report, you decide!!! They file suite!!! Is it possible they mis-translated the text and thought it said "The Lawsuite will set you free!!!" Or did they just ignore the TRUTH???
Gailon Arthur Joy
Just to put things straight. Easter may be in March 2008, but I recall it being in April back in 2004.
And it appears they are trying all they can to make us believe Danny never said any such things back in 2004. Do lies and denials justify the sinner?
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Well, if it can be documented what was actually said back in 2004, then a lie can be determined in this instance.
The name of this topic is "Why lie?"
Why do people lie?
Why did Abraham lie about his wife in saying that she is his sister?
Gen 20:2 And Abraham said of Sarah his wife, She is my sister: and Abimelech king of Gerar sent, and took Sarah.
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The name of this topic is "Why lie?"
Why do people lie?
Why did Abraham lie about his wife in saying that she is his sister?
Gen 20:2 And Abraham said of Sarah his wife, She is my sister: and Abimelech king of Gerar sent, and took Sarah.
It was clearly lack of faith for Abraham. He trusted his own ability to take care of himself more than he trusted God.
The same would be true for Danny Shelton. He trusted/trusts his own ability to take care of himself (with the help of deep-pocketed friends) more than he trusted/trusts God. In the case of discarding Linda in favor of a younger model and using lies to justify it, the answer is still the same. He trusted his own ability to provide for his happiness more than he trusted/trusts God.
God forgives sin, which always ultimately originates with a lack of faith. However, continuing in a path of sin eventually silences the voice of the Holy Spirit so that right seems wrong and wrong seems right. Jesus indicated that this sin (the sin against the Holy Spirit that results in attributing to Satan the work of the Spirit & vice versa) is the one sin that God cannot forgive.
Danny needs our prayers, as do those who support him when they know he is wrong.
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Just to put things straight. Easter may be in March 2008, but I recall it being in April back in 2004.
FYI:
April 11, 2004---Roman Easter
March 29, 2004--Orthodox Easter
The reported event may (?) Have occured in March, on Easter Sunday, if the reference was to the Orthodox tradition.
NOTE: The dates for the Roman and Orthodox Easters rotate throughout the years. Occasionally they occur on the same day. This difference goes back to the historical Easter controverseys that was part of the reason for the division of the Roman and Orthodox branchs of Christianity.
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As far as Noway is concerned it is only the Roman Easter that counts - except that the Easter vacation for schools and a number of institutions starts already the previous weekend. That is when half of Norway head for the mountains with their skis.
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Well, if it can be documented what was actually said back in 2004, then a lie can be determined in this instance.
The name of this topic is "Why lie?"
Why do people lie?
Why did Abraham lie about his wife in saying that she is his sister?
Gen 20:2 And Abraham said of Sarah his wife, She is my sister: and Abimelech king of Gerar sent, and took Sarah.
A small clarification.
Abram didn't lie when he said Sarai was his sister, he just did not tell the rest.
Gen 20:12 And yet indeed she is my sister; she is the daughter of my father, but not the daughter of my mother; and she became my wife.
What he said was, in a sense, true, but with a purpose to deceive; he so concealed a further truth as in effect to deny it.
So it was a lie.
Half truth are still lies. Leading someone to believe something which is not trrue, or allowing them to believe a lie because you omit to clarify or correct that impression is also a lie.
Edited because I forgot to answer "Why do people lie?"
Some do so unintentionally because of ignorance, or because they've been deceived, and don't realize it'a a lie, they move to correct this kind of thing as soon as they realize it, and then others deliberatly, and knowingly lie, they can always come up with so many reasons but everyone has protecting or promoting self at the root, even so called "white Lies".
Jhn 8:44 Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.
Rev 21:8 But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.
just a doodle
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Unfortunately these supporters have their own reasons for believing the lies and they parrot them in the forums as if they are truth.
But I feel sorry for them. At some point they have to realize they have been duped.
:dogwag:
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I believe they lie because the truth hurts. Now the reason that others believe the lie even when it is sooooo clear even a child could see is unanswerable. I ask the question what reasonable person would strap on TNT and walk in a market and kill innocent people and think they are going to heave because of it. I NO LONGER TRY AND UNDERSTAND THE REASON'S WHY JOHN LOMACAN AND OTHERS ARE STILL THERE SUPPORTING DANNY AND THINKING THEY WILL GO TO HEAVEN. I NO LONGER ASK WHY THE CONFERENCE WOULD UPHOLD AND PRAISE DANNY SHELTON AND 3ABN WHEN IT IS SO CRYSTAL CLEAR THE GUY HAS MAJOR PROBLEMS. THE REASON THE BIBLE GIVES IS THAT PEOPLE LOVE A LIE, TO FACE THE TRUTH IS OFTEN TO PAINFUL AND HUMILIATING SO THE LIE MUST CONTINUE ON UNTIL THEY RISE UP AND MEET THE LORD IN THE AIR.
Unfortunately these supporters have their own reasons for believing the lies and they parrot them in the forums as if they are truth.
But I feel sorry for them. At some point they have to realize they have been duped.
:dogwag:
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People may be able to lie to other people, but nobody can lie to God, who knows the truth about all of this, which, if they don't repent, will face the judgment seat of Christ, who is the Judge of all.
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just a doodle
What happened to doodle? Still doodling along?
:dogwag:
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People may be able to lie to other people, but nobody can lie to God, who knows the truth about all of this, which, if they don't repent, will face the judgment seat of Christ, who is the Judge of all.
The exception would be the annointed one...he SINCERELY BELIEVES HE CAN LIE AND GET AWAY WITH IT!!!
Count the times...look at the history...in fact, did you know how you know when Danny Lee Shelton is Lying???
He opens his mouth and talks!!!
Gailon Arthur Joy
AUReporter
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his lips are moving? :rabbit:
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Why lie? Why did perfectly civilized and well educated Germans countenance the murder of millions? Why did freedom loving Americans keep slaves? Why did the advanced civilization of Japan treat the Ainu of Ezogashima as animals? Why did our Christian ancestors flock to the town square to see people tortured to death? Is this a recitation of historical points, or does it reflect a continuity in human nature? Could nice Adventists enjoy watching someone who threatens their comfort burned at the stake? Could they be the first to throw stones at one accused? Yes, I believe they have proven that they would. So why lie? Why not? When your entire system of pride and identity I'd based on false goodness, why not?
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his lips are moving? :rabbit:
Unfortunately, too broad...moving lips could include romantic fervor!
Gailon Arthur Joy
AUReporter
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:ROFL: Bad GJ!! Bad!!
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Why lie? Why did perfectly civilized and well educated Germans countenance the murder of millions? Why did freedom loving Americans keep slaves? Why did the advanced civilization of Japan treat the Ainu of Ezogashima as animals? Why did our Christian ancestors flock to the town square to see people tortured to death? Is this a recitation of historical points, or does it reflect a continuity in human nature? Could nice Adventists enjoy watching someone who threatens their comfort burned at the stake? Could they be the first to throw stones at one accused? Yes, I believe they have proven that they would. So why lie? Why not? When your entire system of pride and identity I'd based on false goodness, why not?
History ::)
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I have been amazed at some of the lies that have been told to DS's supporters in order to explain away documented facts that have been discovered and posted on the internet. At first I asked myself "why would these lies be told by one who knows the facts will prove them to be false.
Then I realized that 1. If a lie works now, the story teller will not worry about the consequences untill and if the lie is found out. 2. Lies have been successfully covered up in the past and perhaps the truth can be legally locked away from the public. 3. If a lie is discovered, another story can always be invented to explain it away.
Thi is just as true today as when it was first posted and nobody has been able to document that it isn't.
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The same would be true for Danny Shelton. He trusted/trusts his own ability to take care of himself (with the help of deep-pocketed friends) more than he trusted/trusts God. In the case of discarding Linda in favor of a younger model and using lies to justify it, the answer is still the same. He trusted his own ability to provide for his happiness more than he trusted/trusts God.
God forgives sin, which always ultimately originates with a lack of faith. However, continuing in a path of sin eventually silences the voice of the Holy Spirit so that right seems wrong and wrong seems right. Jesus indicated that this sin (the sin against the Holy Spirit that results in attributing to Satan the work of the Spirit & vice versa) is the one sin that God cannot forgive.
Danny needs our prayers, as do those who support him when they know he is wrong.
Perhaps even more those who have not yet discovered he is wrong.
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Yes, I do think that some don't realize that.
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http://www.cnn.com/2011/12/16/justice/stephen-glass/index.html?hpt=hp_bn2
A liar's fate?
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http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=211069132333792&set=a.167198946720811.36656.167179836722722&type=1&theater