Advent Talk
Issues & Concerns Category => 3ABN => Topic started by: Bob Pickle on October 27, 2008, 05:32:12 AM
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When the first angel's message was preached, GC 369 says that the following was one of the effects: "Those whose lives had been marked with dishonesty were anxious to make restitution."
When Danny Shelton accepts the 3 angels' messages, there will be a similar anxiety to make restitution.
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When the first angel's message was preached, GC 369 says that the following was one of the effects: "Those whose lives had been marked with dishonesty were anxious to make restitution."
When Danny Shelton accepts the 3 angels' messages, there will be a similar anxiety to make restitution.
It occurs to me that much of the unpleasantness on this forum would rapidly disappear if some members could stop trying to force repentance and restitution on others and just let the Holy Spirit do His job by Himself.
It seems to me that He is far more qualified then an inquisitor or self-righteous Pharisee has ever been to do God's will.
Doesn't the bible say something about examining oneself first and that we will be judged as we judge others???
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It occurs to me that much of the unpleasantness on this forum would rapidly disappear if some members could stop trying to force repentance and restitution on others and just let the Holy Spirit do His job by Himself.
It seems to me that He is far more qualified then an inquisitor or self-righteous Pharisee has ever been to do God's will.
Doesn't the bible say something about examining oneself first and that we will be judged as we judge others???
It depends on which portion of the Scripture you are reading. Jesus also told the parable of the Good Samaritan. It condemns the priest and the Levite for just passing by the victim by the roadside. Some of us witnessed a woman being thrown into a pit of untrue condemnations - vicious and unchristian judgment - and we felt it was our Christina duty to defend this defenseless woman. Only a vicious and unchristian Pharisee would judge such an action.
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It occurs to me that much of the unpleasantness on this forum would rapidly disappear if some members could stop trying to force repentance and restitution on others and just let the Holy Spirit do His job by Himself.
It seems to me that He is far more qualified then an inquisitor or self-righteous Pharisee has ever been to do God's will.
Doesn't the bible say something about examining oneself first and that we will be judged as we judge others???
It depends on which portion of the Scripture you are reading. Jesus also told the parable of the Good Samaritan. It condemns the priest and the Levite for just passing by the victim by the roadside. Some of us witnessed a woman being thrown into a pit of untrue condemnations - vicious and unchristian judgment - and we felt it was our Christina duty to defend this defenseless woman. Only a vicious and unchristian Pharisee would judge such an action.
Agreed, Johann!
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It occurs to me that much of the unpleasantness on this forum would rapidly disappear if some members could stop trying to force repentance and restitution on others and just let the Holy Spirit do His job by Himself.
It seems to me that He is far more qualified then an inquisitor or self-righteous Pharisee has ever been to do God's will.
Doesn't the bible say something about examining oneself first and that we will be judged as we judge others???
It depends on which portion of the Scripture you are reading. Jesus also told the parable of the Good Samaritan. It condemns the priest and the Levite for just passing by the victim by the roadside. Some of us witnessed a woman being thrown into a pit of untrue condemnations - vicious and unchristian judgment - and we felt it was our Christina duty to defend this defenseless woman. Only a vicious and unchristian Pharisee would judge such an action.
Agreed, Johann!
Do you really? I think far too many here jump on the bandwagon and agree without really considering what they are agreeing with.
I don't believe anyone here would disagree with the principles expressed and taught in the parable of the good Samaritan. All should care for and help a victim as needed especially when they are not in our belief system.
But at the same time I don't recall the good Samaritan hunting down the perpetrator, the Priest, or the Levite, do you?
Nor do I recall Jesus chasing the Pharisees down and forcing repentance or restitution either, or beating them over the head with God's word, stalking and harassing them, and even publishing reports to shame and embarrass them...
I was thinking about this, it is true, some put themselves in the role of the Holy Spirit, and yet I also haven't heard of a inquisitor or self righteous pharisee yet who could come close to filling that role or doing God's will. Our thoughts and our ways are not His...
It just makes me sick. I believe this kind of thinking and behavior is blasphemy. Just imagine the Holy Spirit using the Pickle Joy and Co. tactics.. badgering until the subject is worn down, that would be more like torture than wooing. Few things make me more angry than seeing God misrepresented. sigh..
I refuse to give into that but I do agree with the following:
"much of the unpleasantness on this forum would rapidly disappear if some members could just let the Holy Spirit do His job by Himself..."
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You forget. The hunter is named Danny Lee Shelton.
If that scoundrel Danny Shelton is going to keep on hunting me down, and perpetrating a fraud upon our people in the process, then I see nothing wrong with kindly pointing out how big a fraud it is.
He has been called the Lord's anointed. The Hebrew and Greek words for "anointed" are Messiah and Christ. Jesus warned us about false Christs and false prophets in the end of time, and told us that we would know them by their fruits. If Danny is not anxious to make restitution to those he has wronged by his deceptions, then he is demonstrating by his fruit that he is a false Christ and a false prophet, and people need to know.
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Do you really? I think far too many here jump on the bandwagon and agree without really considering what they are agreeing with.
I don't believe anyone here would disagree with the principles expressed and taught in the parable of the good Samaritan. All should care for and help a victim as needed especially when they are not in our belief system.
But at the same time I don't recall the good Samaritan hunting down the perpetrator, the Priest, or the Levite, do you?
Since when has the Good Samaritan been our supreme example? I happen to be a follower of Jesus Christ, and He certainly hunted down - not so much the perpetrator, but the Priest and the Levite. Some Bible students even suggest they may have been in the audience when Jesus told the story. And the Holy Spirit saw to it that the story remains with us as a guide for us - even now 2000 years later!
Nor do I recall Jesus chasing the Pharisees down and forcing repentance or restitution either, or beating them over the head with God's word, stalking and harassing them, and even publishing reports to shame and embarrass them...
If we haven't heard that sory since kindergarten it may be a good idea to read and study it again.
I was thinking about this, it is true, some put themselves in the role of the Holy Spirit, and yet I also haven't heard of a inquisitor or self righteous pharisee yet who could come close to filling that role or doing God's will. Our thoughts and our ways are not His...
The Holy Spirit is not encouraging wishy-washy Christianity. He encourages action, and not mere wanton waiting while nothing happens. Pity that scoundrel who never dares speak up against evil, even if the perpetrator has a saintly face or function. How did Paul treat Peter? (Should we ask the next General Conference session to delete that story from Scripture?) How did Nathan tread David?
It just makes me sick. I believe this kind of thinking and behavior is blasphemy. Just imagine the Holy Spirit using the Pickle Joy and Co. tactics.. badgering until the subject is worn down, that would be more like torture than wooing. Few things make me more angry than seeing God misrepresented. sigh..
Praise the Lord for your ailment. Otherwise you will never realize you need a remedy.
I refuse to give into that but I do agree with the following:
"much of the unpleasantness on this forum would rapidly disappear if some members could just let the Holy Spirit do His job by Himself..."
This forum happens to be for humans. If you are too weak to endure some soundness, then join some other group for those who do nothing.
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The Holy Spirit is not encouraging wishy-washy Christianity. He encourages action, and not mere wanton waiting while nothing happens. Pity that scoundrel who never dares speak up against evil, even if the perpetrator has a saintly face or function. How did Paul treat Peter? (Should we ask the next General Conference session to delete that story from Scripture?) How did Nathan tread David?
This forum happens to be for humans. If you are too weak to endure some soundness, then join some other group for those who do nothing.
Encouraged by the Holy Spirit..........Since 3ABN has issued a press release, I would suggest that folks might take it and send it to every media outlet and talk show host that you can think of. Larry King, Fox News, that Grace lady, Christianity Today, Wall Street Journal, etc.
Holy Spirit inspired ....National Enquirer would even maybe pay you for the tip.
Wonder hiow much the Holy Spirit would pay via the National Enquirer for this hot tip.??
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It depends on which portion of the Scripture you are reading. Jesus also told the parable of the Good Samaritan. It condemns the priest and the Levite for just passing by the victim by the roadside. Some of us witnessed a woman being thrown into a pit of untrue condemnations - vicious and unchristian judgment - and we felt it was our Christina duty to defend this defenseless woman.
I don't believe anyone here would disagree with the principles expressed and taught in the parable of the good Samaritan. All should care for and help a victim as needed especially when they are not in our belief system.
But at the same time I don't recall the good Samaritan hunting down the perpetrator, the Priest, or the Levite, do you?
Since when has the Good Samaritan been our supreme example? I happen to be a follower of Jesus Christ...
Wasn't the "Good Samaritan" your example and your argument?
Yes. so, you tell us.
Was it since Jesus Christ gave him as an example, or when you, Johann, brought up the parable of Jesus Christ about the good Samaritan here in this topic as an example to justify yourself, Pickle, Joy & co.?
Nor do I recall Jesus chasing the Pharisees down and forcing repentance or restitution either, or beating them over the head with God's word, stalking and harassing them, and even publishing reports to shame and embarrass them...
If we haven't heard that sory since kindergarten it may be a good idea to read and study it again.
maybe you should explain the difference between your methods and Christ's, or at least explain how he hunted down the pharisees as you seem to be implying.
I am very interested in hearing that POV explained with biblical support.
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Jesus went into the temple where people were merchandising and making money off of selling God. He made a whip and hunted them down. He physically chased them out of God's house with the threat of beating them, not with the bible, but with a whip.
In public pronouncements Jesus called the Pharisees all kinds of unpleasant names. He warned the people about them and harrassed and tormented them with his judgements on them. Yes, a report was published that has heaped shame and embarassment on them for 2,000 years, and it is called The Holy bible.
It is interesting to see that people who think it wonderful and laudable for Danny and 3ABN to hunt down and try to destroy Linda and others suddenly think it abominable and unchristian for that kind of behaviour to be reflected in others.
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It is interesting to see that people who think it wonderful and laudable for Danny and 3ABN to hunt down and try to destroy Linda and others suddenly think it abominable and unchristian for that kind of behaviour to be reflected in others.
I am not going to try to speak for anyone else. I have never thought what DS did or was accused of doing was laudable or wonderful.
It was in many cases abominable and unchristian if true and I believe much of it was.
But it would be very hard to out christian this.......
Since 3ABN has issued a press release, I would suggest that folks might take it and send it to every media outlet and talk show host that you can think of. Larry King, Fox News, that Grace lady, Christianity Today, Wall Street Journal, etc.
Holy Spirit inspired ????....National Enquirer would even maybe pay you for the tip.
Why doesn't Bob take care of notifying the media and maybe get paid for notifying the National Enquirer??
Might be enough to keep him for awhile.
Can we believe Christ would go to a media publication like the National Enquirer for pay. Somehow I can't picture that. Nor do I recall in the examples you gave Christ asking others to go to the media of his day.
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Nor do I recall in the examples you gave Christ asking others to go to the media of his day.
The only media of his day was word of mouth and what people wrote. His diciples wrote it down, the Catholic church declared that those writings were canon scripture, those stories have reprinted and sold more than any other piece of writing in history, they have been spread around the world by 3ABN and other TV and radion networks, they have been told to children in Sabbath School, and preached from the pulpit. No media of any day could have taken those examples further than Jesus' diciples did.
That aside, it is demonstrated that he did hunt people down, harrass, embarass, and publicly say terrible things about them.
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Also, it is easy for people to get pompous and jump all over Bob and Gailon for their tactics, but when a megalithic machine went after a few small people totally intent on crushing them forever, where were you? Two little men stepped out and tried to at least do something. You can pounce on them for their tactics, but they at least did something and tried to help people who were being crushed, instead of sitting comfortably back on their haunches and issuing armchair judgements. No good deed goes unpunished, and it is usually people who will do no risky deeds at all who cheer on the punishment of those who do.
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The only media of his day was word of mouth and what people wrote. His disciples wrote it down, the Catholic church declared that those writings were canon scripture, those stories have reprinted and sold more than any other piece of writing in history, they have been spread around the world by 3ABN and other TV and radion networks, they have been told to children in Sabbath School, and preached from the pulpit. No media of any day could have taken those examples further than Jesus' disciples did.
That aside, it is demonstrated that he did hunt people down, harass, embarrass, and publicly say terrible things about them.
You cannot equate scripture with what is going on here. But aside from that,take a stab, anyone at answering honestly. Especially Bob and Daryl. Even tho Bob lives in my hoetown area I had never heard of him till this with 3ABN.
I have since spoken to people that have known him for a longtime. I have also had quite a lengthy experience with Daryl on this topic.
Substitute the name DS with Jan Paulsen or Don Schneider. How eager and approving would you be then to stoop to the National Enquirer,for pay no less.
I know for a fact Daryl does not approve of any action against church scandal where it becomes public knowledge.
My son's situation could not have been more clear cut. We had admission, independent proof,not only of the guilt of the pastor,but five conferences that had moved him to spread his questionable charms.
Daryl made it very clear where he stood. That is his right. Now that this is the dreaded independent ministry being hacked to death,all bets are off. I think if it were the organized SDA it would be hidden if allowed at all.
How many of you would want the National Enquirer to suddenly blast my son's ordeal nationwide. And for money??
Bob,this took place in your own conference. Did you get in there to straighten out what was wrong.?
Would you if it were Jan Paulsen or Don Schneider.
I don't believe you would. As long as it is an independent ministry that has not been enthusiastically
embraced by the official denomination the attitude is much different.
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Also, it is easy for people to get pompous and jump all over Bob and Gailon for their tactics, but when a megalithic machine went after a few small people totally intent on crushing them forever, where were you? Two little men stepped out and tried to at least do something. You can pounce on them for their tactics, but they at least did something and tried to help people who were being crushed, instead of sitting comfortably back on their haunches and issuing armchair judgements. No good deed goes unpunished, and it is usually people who will do no risky deeds at all who cheer on the punishment of those who do.
Yeah, I know about the pompous. Where was I?? Didn't know. Had never watched 3ABN. There is no excuse for asking others to contact national media. Let them do it.
instead of sitting comfortably back on their haunches and issuing armchair judgements. No good deed goes unpunished, and it is usually people who will do no risky deeds at all who cheer on the punishment of those who do.
Had the behaviour been ethical,many issuing armchair judgements would have continued to help.
Who is cheering on the punsihment of anyone except Bob. Bob wants to heap it on thru the media as many as he can reach apparantly.Or I should say he wants others to reach so he can say he was contacted
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Yeah, I know about the pompous. Where was I?? Didn't know. Had never watched 3ABN. There is no excuse for asking others to contact national media. Let them do it.
instead of sitting comfortably back on their haunches and issuing armchair judgements. No good deed goes unpunished, and it is usually people who will do no risky deeds at all who cheer on the punishment of those who do.
Had the behaviour been ethical,many issuing armchair judgements would have continued to help.
Who is cheering on the punsihment of anyone except Bob. Bob wants to heap it on thru the media as many as he can reach apparantly.Or I should say he wants others to reach so he can say he was contacted
Had the behaviour been ethical? Many of those armchair judges were doing nothing back before Bob and Gailon, and what have they done outside of Bob and Gailon's crusade? They are not bound by Bob and Gailon. Again, they are doing nothing but attacking that tactics of a few people who are at least trying. also, you may opine that it is not a good thing for people who are being fooled, fleeced, or otherwise victimized to find out about it, but a good many people will strongly disagree with you on that.
And yes, many have cheered 3ABN on in their punishment of Bob and Gailon. You have too.
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I am not saying that people should feel obligated to do anything, I am just saying that even if one doesn't like their tactics, at least two guys have taken the risk of sticking up for people when most people haven't and wouldn't. That is commendable.
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I am not saying that people should feel obligated to do anything, I am just saying that even if one doesn't like their tactics, at least two guys have taken the risk of sticking up for people when most people haven't and wouldn't. That is commendable.
Amazing what a couple of per se non professional lawyers have accomplished, in spite of a lot of ridicule and fault finding.
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Had the behaviour been ethical? Those armchair judges were doing nothing back before Bob and Gailon, and what have they done outside of Bob and Gailon's crusade? They are not bound by Bob and Gailon. Again, they are doing nothing but attacking that tactics of a few people who are at least trying.
And yes, many have cheered 3ABN on in their punishment of Bob and Gailon.
As some have cheered Bob and Gailon on,to the point of accepting some of the same they were fighting.
Are they trying and it is accepted because it is not the official SDA org. but an independent ministry???
Are they concerned about abuses of power and corruption in thei own conferences and higher??
You didn't answer but maybe you don't know.
Would this be going on and would Bob be calling for volunteers to call the media in hopes of getting media attention if we were talking about Jan Paulsen?? Would we be ready to call the National Enquirer,expecting payment and then sicing them on Jan Paulsen.... I tihnk not, and I don't think based on past experience that Daryl would allow that. If it is selective corruption and abuses of power is what is going on then it is nothing more than getting even.
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And yes, many have cheered 3ABN on in their punishment of Bob and Gailon. You have too.
That isn't quite true. I did say that I thought that LS,DS,Bob and Gailon deserved one another.
I have always thought 3ABN guilty of many things.
There is nothing to cheer
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I am not saying that people should feel obligated to do anything, I am just saying that even if one doesn't like their tactics, at least two guys have taken the risk of sticking up for people when most people haven't and wouldn't. That is commendable.
When it gets to the point that Bob wants the little minions to contact the media so bob can have his day of fame, it is hardly commendable.
You still haven't answered, neither has Bob or Daryl. Would this be happening,would there be a desire to get any and all of the National Media because a scandal surrounding Jan Paulsen became known.
NOT A CHANCE. And then the corruption fighters become as bad as the corruption they are fighting
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IMO you have certainly exhibited some glee in what you thought would happen to Bob and Gailon in court. That is usually what can be expected when someone tries to help others when it carries risk to do so. The people who won't do anything at all seem to be like chickens with one that is wounded.
Again, you can keep right on attacking Bob and Gailon for doing what they can under the circumstances they are in, but I will say it again, and you may be right in some of your criticisms, but at least they have stepped out and taken the risk of actually doing something. They have stood up to a bully of a man and an organization that has been known for crushing people and took them on with the full knowledge that they would probably be crushed too. They did this to help and defend a few people who almost everyone else passed up.
(change in red)
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If you do some searching at Maritime, I think you will notice that things are not as stringent there in this area as they used to be. :wave:
If you notice, there was even a time when these 3ABN topics and discussions were not even permitted at Maritime until after it became apparent what was happening and that what was happening was coming from very reliable people and could be documented. :wave:
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I am not saying that people should feel obligated to do anything, I am just saying that even if one doesn't like their tactics, at least two guys have taken the risk of sticking up for people when most people haven't and wouldn't. That is commendable.
When it gets to the point that Bob wants the little minions to contact the media so bob can have his day of fame, it is hardly commendable.
You still haven't answered, neither has Bob or Daryl. Would this be happening,would there be a desire to get any and all of the National Media because a scandal surrounding Jan Paulsen became known.
NOT A CHANCE. And then the corruption fighters become as bad as the corruption they are fighting
I can't answer for Bob and Daryl, but I will answer for myself. If Jan Paulsen did what Danny did and used the SDA church in the manner that Danny used 3ABN as a personal weapon against individuals with whom he had personal issues, I most certainly would care to see that he and the church were exposed everywhere in the world that the church operates, on every form of media available. The people being evangelized into a vile organization like that would deserve to know.
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I agree with Habanero, but only after all other avenues have first been tried, as was done in the case of DS/3ABN.
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I agree with Habanero, but only after all other avenues have first been tried, as was done in the case of DS/3ABN.
I agree. That is just a given.
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I agree with Habanero, but only after all other avenues have first been tried, as was done in the case of DS/3ABN.
Are you saying that if my family was in the situation it was when our paths first crossed you would now support instead of giving every EW and biblical text to show me how wrong my family was.
We didn't even have a denial, simply never was a question?
A short time ago Ginge did her best to acquaint others to a serious problem. It was barely acknowledged.
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I agree with Habanero, but only after all other avenues have first been tried, as was done in the case of DS/3ABN.
I agree. That is just a given.
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You can be as right as can be, but if you lose your own ethics and integrity along the way,sometimes you can't get that back
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I agree with Habanero, but only after all other avenues have first been tried, as was done in the case of DS/3ABN.
I agree. That is just a given.
You can be as right as can be, but if you lose your own ethics and integrity along the way,sometimes you can't get that back
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That could be. IMO, the act of attacking people who are at least trying to do something when one will do nothing themselves reflects a significant loss of integrity and ethics. It is easy to attack people for how they do something without coming up with and enacting a better alternative themselves.
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That could be. IMO, the act of attacking people who are at least trying to do something when one will do nothing themselves reflects a significant loss of integrity and ethics. It is easy to attack people for how they do something without coming up with and enacting a better alternative themselves.
There is always a better alternative to calling people trash and having no value. It can be easy to attack someone that is trying to right a wrong. Trust me, I know that one a lot better than most.
It wasn't and isn't the fact that they exposed 3ABN,it is the tactics.
The pretense. What others look at or object to is usually not what bothers me. I have a very dear friend on here that I think I confuse at times.
Calling others trash is bad enough,but very little objection to that. I have come to know a couple of people that have received the brunt of Gailons railing at them, invoking God's wrath. They are pretty decent human beings, they simply still have faith in DS and what he says. They do not deserve to be verbally lashed.
Bob and his pretense is another factor. I could not just accept his word. To many dances around a post.
One topic is a good example. "Explosive New Charges" made to sound as if artiste just stumbled across this new revelation. Poppycock. Pretty obvious that was staged and just another attention getter.
Why not be just up front and say,Look at this, what do you think?
Minor things like that. I don't have any interest in wading thru to find what is true and what I don't think is.
It is never big lies or exaggerations that bother me. It is the little ones that don't make any sense and are unnecessary
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I would respect that if you were doing something or at least saying something regarding what 3ABN and Danny have done, and are doing, that made more sense or at least showed a more sensible path to take. Attacking Bob and Gailon for their tactics is no more sensible or productive in accomplishing anything in the 3ABN/DS mess than the worst of the tactics they are doing because the only thing you do here is attack them for their tactics when you have completely failed to show us any tactics that would work better. Again, you are simply attacking people's methods without doing anything yourself. I respect them for at least doing something. you have done nothing that I know of.
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Bonnie - what has Bob ever done to make you think that he is doing this just to have a few minutes of fame? That just makes no sense at all. This can't be easy and must take up an enormous amount of time, but you keep bringing up the fame thing. Most people in my church don't even know the lawsuits exist and wouldn't recognize either name. Maybe some national attention would wake people up to what happened or is still happening at 3ABN. The GC certainly closed their collective eyes to what happened.
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I would respect that if you were doing something or at least saying something regarding what 3ABN and Danny have done, and are doing, that made more sense or at least showed a more sensible path to take. Attacking Bob and Gailon for their tactics is no more sensible or productive in accomplishing anything in the 3ABN/DS mess than the worst of the tactics they are doing because the only thing you do here is attack them for their tactics when you have completely failed to show us any tactics that would work better. Again, you are simply attacking people's methods without doing anything yourself. I respect them for at least doing something. you have done nothing that I know of.
What would you think they should do now? What are they doing? Other than I am sure hoping to drop the lawsuit?
Sometimes the legal route is the only one left and if that is no longer feasible you have done your best.
We were fortunate in that one of the best attorney's in the state saw in my son's case a chance to write new law. Had that failed,it would have been over. Simple as that. Even with that,many, many critized and found fault. The forums, the conference and many people other than my home church.
There are always going to be vulnerable people that are preyed on by predators of all kinds. The denomination as a whole wants nothing to do with correcting these same type of problems in their own ranks but will gleefully go after an independent like 3ABN.
Correcting much of this at the core would do far more than all the calling the National Enquirer. However that is far to much work, and very little glory or minutes of fame
What does Bob have to gain by fixating on TS. He is over as an issue unless he re-offends. DS did nothing illegal. But Bob's fixation on it does not reflect well on Duane Clem. I believe him without a doubt,but at this point several have commented and not favorably. I can't see much that Duane will gain thru Bob. Duane could become active in preventing the type of abuse he suffered at the hands of a pastor.
I am not sure but at the time it took place with Duane I don't even think it would have been considered a crime here. But there are places he can add his experience and help others.
Bob is not helping him. Bob wants something else as far as I am concerned.
Put the knowledge and experience to work in ways that do the most good.The National Enquirer is not it.
Bob could possibly have concern for the way his conference has operated. Bob could work as strenously for Polly's Place.
Both might want to expend some of that energy on their families
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Bonnie - what has Bob ever done to make you think that he is doing this just to have a few minutes of fame? That just makes no sense at all. This can't be easy and must take up an enormous amount of time, but you keep bringing up the fame thing. Most people in my church don't even know the lawsuits exist and wouldn't recognize either name. Maybe some national attention would wake people up to what happened or is still happening at 3ABN. The GC certainly closed their collective eyes to what happened.
Because that is what I think it is. Enjoying the position he holds. Gailon without question enjoys the battle.
There is a difference between national attention focused on a serious issue legitimately and attention urged and directed by Bob. Suggesting payment if you called one of the sleeziest paper out in print.
This focus on who broke the sabbath this week. Had that been anyone except someone with a tie to 3ABN the handwringing over someone not keeping the Sabbath correctly it would have never been an issue. I am sure there will be another announcement soon over another sabbath breaker.
Reading many things that bob and Gailon have posted. On a regular basis Gailon blasts any in his path not moving along with him. They are trash and have no value,routinely invoking God's wrath on any that do not march in lockstep to gailon. The worst of that is the agreement, even if it is silent that lets Gailon know it is fine to do that.
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Habanero,
I know what the following means to me, tell me what it means to you.
Waiting for someone to be struck down and hopefully soon. This is a man I am thankful is not on my side
Frankly, I would hope the fools would repeat it every chance they get!!! Just how long will it take the Lord to strike them all down for their abomination???
Not long, I trust, as their is a work to be done and we should not be tied up with this follishness!!!
Added
Matthew 5:22
22But I tell you that anyone who is angry with his brother[a]will be subject to judgment. Again, anyone who says to his brother, 'Raca,' is answerable to the Sanhedrin. But anyone who says, 'You fool!' will be in danger of the fire of hell.
It seems to me that gailon is very fond of using this word
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Again, it is easy to tell everyone else where they are wrong in how they are trying to get something done without actually doing anything one's self. No matter how much you can hurl at them for how they go about doing it, at least they are trying. They haven't just sat back and said that it can't be done and that the church is unchangeable and that nothing can be done that will change or accomplish anything, they jumped in with both feet to at least try effecting change where it is needed.
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I am so thankful for Bob and Gailon! I believe God chose each of them. They have brought to the front so much that it is hard to believe that 3ABN and Danny were so blatantly out of God's will.
Danny & 3ABN now want to drop the suit long enough to squelch the IRS Reports! He doesn't want anyone to see the financials. That is what this is all about. Yes, the financial wrong doings! The only reason for this dismissal is to hide that info. However, they still want the right to come back and resume the lawsuit after his financials have been sealed!
I read Walt's letter and was as disgusted as I was when he explained why Linda was gone. Without a doubt, I believe Walt is just as guilty as Danny Shelton. He is an accomplice to the wrong doing with the Trust Funds. He know full well there were problems with trust funds.
He says the employee complaints were dropped. What about their problems with the trust funds themselves? Forget the employees!
Greed is the name of the game. I believe Danny felt God would want him to have nicer things. I feel Danny thought his wage were too low, he compensated it through skimming cash receipts, his books and eBay. They also borrowed Trust Funds. What if it was your trust funds that were borrowed.
When people donated to 3ABN, did they mean to donate it to the personal income of Danny Shelton and Mollie Steenson, or did they mean for it to go to the operation of 3ABN? I believe Danny took what he felt was justly his. He was the one that could beg and get people to donate, so therefore he deserved a commission of the amount received. I believe Danny has a higher opinion of himself than others do.
I believe he felt that the cash receipts were his. Is that why the cash amounts changed once Danny and Mollie got their cuts before the cash got to finance? I believe Danny feels entitled to greater income. I wonder why he did not feel Linda should share in this extra money? Instead of Linda, it was Mollie! Did he have to bring Mollie in on his taking what was not his to make her as guilty as him, and therefore keep her quiet.
It is time to submit the 2007 IRS form 990's. It will be revealing for sure.
The IRS has not notified me about the investigation being over. Therefore, I still believe the investigation is not complete.
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It occurs to me that much of the unpleasantness on this forum would rapidly disappear if some members could stop trying to force repentance and restitution on others and just let the Holy Spirit do His job by Himself.
It seems to me that He is far more qualified then an inquisitor or self-righteous Pharisee has ever been to do God's will.
Doesn't the bible say something about examining oneself first and that we will be judged as we judge others???
It depends on which portion of the Scripture you are reading. Jesus also told the parable of the Good Samaritan. It condemns the priest and the Levite for just passing by the victim by the roadside. Some of us witnessed a woman being thrown into a pit of untrue condemnations - vicious and unchristian judgment - and we felt it was our Christina duty to defend this defenseless woman. Only a vicious and unchristian Pharisee would judge such an action.
:amen: :praying:
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Fran, it is easy for people to look at what they do, listen to the people who praise them for what they do, generate praise for what they do, decide to believe the praise that they have generated, and then believe that they have done so much more for God than other people, that God would want them to have more and take more. It is easy to feel reimbursed when taking what one feels they deserve, especially when they assume the mantle of divine authority, when masses of people, or even just a few, believe they they do have the mantle of divine authority.
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Even with that,many, many critized and found fault. The forums, the conference and many people other than my home church.
And here you are doing exactly that. You seem to have become what you are claiming to abhore.
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Danny & 3ABN now want to drop the suit long enough to squelch the IRS Reports! He doesn't want anyone to see the financials. That is what this is all about. Yes, the financial wrong doings! The only reason for this dismissal is to hide that info. However, they still want the right to come back and resume the lawsuit after his financials have been sealed!
I read Walt's letter and was as disgusted as I was when he explained why Linda was gone. Without a doubt, I believe Walt is just as guilty as Danny Shelton. He is an accomplice to the wrong doing with the Trust Funds. He know full well there were problems with trust funds.
Fran,
I undertand that. I am sure DS doesn't want his conduct and acts out there in a trial. I have never thought him innocent,but not entirely sure LS is either. That doesn't mean she shouldn't have been treated fairly in the divorce . She kind of lost me with the "trick playing with a pregnancy kit" If your marriage is in trouble and you are already accused of infidelity,you don't go rubbing his nose in it and call it game. Especially LS as she had to know the capabilities of the man she was dealing with.
He says the employee complaints were dropped. What about their problems with the trust funds themselves? Forget the employees!
If they were you cannot take on their problems. If there were illegal acts and the ones harmed will not pursue you can't do it for them
Greed is the name of the game. I believe Danny felt God would want him to have nicer things. I feel Danny thought his wage were too low, he compensated it through skimming cash receipts, his books and eBay. They also borrowed Trust Funds. What if it was your trust funds that were borrowed.
If it were my trust fund I would be spitting mad. I would go after it ,But not ask you to go after it for me.
This is the reason I will not nor ever have donated to a ministry as this. I do not trust televagelists. I am not big on many of the org. the church has just for that reason. Personally I think ADRA does a great work,I am glad there are people that can support it,but I will find other area's for my personal help and money. Just as they needed to re-do a tennis court because of the sun wasn't it??
When people have acess to other people's money ,whether it be the government or the church, you can bet many are going to feel entitled
When people donated to 3ABN, did they mean to donate it to the personal income of Danny Shelton and Mollie Steenson, or did they mean for it to go to the operation of 3ABN? I believe Danny took what he felt was justly his. He was the one that could beg and get people to donate, so therefore he deserved a commission of the amount received. I believe Danny has a higher opinion of himself than others do.
I don't argue with that. Most seem to end up with this God complex and feel themselves above the ordinary. I personally think DS has an ego that knows few boundries.
I believe he felt that the cash receipts were his. Is that why the cash amounts changed once Danny and Mollie got their cuts before the cash got to finance? I believe Danny feels entitled to greater income. I wonder why he did not feel Linda should share in this extra money? Instead of Linda, it was Mollie! Did he have to bring Mollie in on his taking what was not his to make her as guilty as him, and therefore keep her quiet
It is time to submit the 2007 IRS form 990's. It will be revealing for sure.
That may be. If that shows wrongdoing it certainly should. Why give a woman you are divorcing anymore than is necessary?
The IRS has not notified me about the investigation being over. Therefore, I still believe the investigation is not complete.
I am sure it is possible. Originally I had thought it probably was, altho not the way DS reported as in ,Not one infraction, apologizing, etc. That was nothing but poppycock. Time will tell on that I would think.
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It occurs to me that much of the unpleasantness on this forum would rapidly disappear if some members could stop trying to force repentance and restitution on others and just let the Holy Spirit do His job by Himself.
It seems to me that He is far more qualified then an inquisitor or self-righteous Pharisee has ever been to do God's will.
Doesn't the bible say something about examining oneself first and that we will be judged as we judge others???
It depends on which portion of the Scripture you are reading. Jesus also told the parable of the Good Samaritan. It condemns the priest and the Levite for just passing by the victim by the roadside. Some of us witnessed a woman being thrown into a pit of untrue condemnations - vicious and unchristian judgment - and we felt it was our Christina duty to defend this defenseless woman. Only a vicious and unchristian Pharisee would judge such an action.
Agreed, Johann!
Do you really? I think far too many here jump on the bandwagon and agree without really considering what they are agreeing with.
I don't believe anyone here would disagree with the principles expressed and taught in the parable of the good Samaritan. All should care for and help a victim as needed especially when they are not in our belief system.
But at the same time I don't recall the good Samaritan hunting down the perpetrator, the Priest, or the Levite, do you?
Nor do I recall Jesus chasing the Pharisees down and forcing repentance or restitution either, or beating them over the head with God's word, stalking and harassing them, and even publishing reports to shame and embarrass them...
I was thinking about this, it is true, some put themselves in the role of the Holy Spirit, and yet I also haven't heard of a inquisitor or self righteous pharisee yet who could come close to filling that role or doing God's will. Our thoughts and our ways are not His...
It just makes me sick. I believe this kind of thinking and behavior is blasphemy. Just imagine the Holy Spirit using the Pickle Joy and Co. tactics.. badgering until the subject is worn down, that would be more like torture than wooing. Few things make me more angry than seeing God misrepresented. sigh..
I refuse to give into that but I do agree with the following:
"much of the unpleasantness on this forum would rapidly disappear if some members could just let the Holy Spirit do His job by Himself..."
The Bible is one continuous report of miscreants and the results of sin in the camp. And it reveals that justice prevails!!! .
You, surmizer, have failed to have surmized the biblical issues!!! And when did your Hero, DANNY LEE SHELTON, end his whispered reports of his former wife without the evidence to back his tall tales and to justify jettisoning the old grey mare and trade her for a new young filly? Did you ever wonder what those lies and innuendos cost her, financially and emotionally? And what should Danny Lee Shelton's reward be?
Biblical, I am sure!!!
It is sick indeed, that the face of Adventism is a man that has to lie, cheat and steal to get where he is!!!
What he deserves and what he has taken are clearly two different things.
So get use to the idea that Justice pursues in-equity until equity is brought back to balance. That is why the Goddess of Justice carries a scale. I wonder, would Danny Lee Shelton be found wanton in the scales of justice? I KNOW HE WOULD!!! I intend to tip the scales!!!
Gailon Arthur Joy